VOTE FOR TOM CHEEK!!! DETAILS AND LINK AT THE BOTTOM OF THE POST!!!!!
12:10 AM Eastern
Not much of a post tonight, due to some major back issues, but I’ll try to put an update up here by early Friday afternoon or thereabouts.
Just, man is Roy Halladay something else. Aside from all the everything, dig this: Halladay retired the last 13 Yankees he faced tonight – and did it with just 32 pitches.
Here’s tonight’s edition of the JaysTalk, for your listening pleasure:
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Remember, today and every day in the month of September, please vote for Tom Cheek and ONLY for Tom Cheek to be on the ballot for the Ford C. Frick Award to gain entry into the broadcasters’ wing of the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. It’ll make more of an impact on the voters if Tom alone gets the overwhelming majority of the votes. Just click on this link:
http://web.baseballhalloffame.org/awards/frick_2008/vote.jsp
It’s a bit of a pain to fill out all the info, but it only takes two minutes at the most, and Tom Cheek was certainly worth your time. Thank you.
Rational, reasonable comments are always welcome!
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Hot tub and five beers usually works for me if the back is tight.
The Doc is a true gem. Too bad he can only go every fifth day. The Jays could use a true superstar like that on the field and in the lineup every day.
- Ken PaganIt was great to see Halladay smile it doesn’t happen very often. He is a special guy and I have no idea why the ball park isn’t full whenever he pitches.
MW: Me neither, but then, it wasn’t full when Roger Clemens pitched here, either.
- Scott GrundyDoc is the first man to beat the Yankees 5 times in a season since Luis Tiant in 76!
Was watching the YES network’s coverage of the game and they couldn’t stop singing Doc’s praises. One must know that the media in NY especially any associated with the Yankees, very rarely if ever praise anyone outside of NY. When they do, they pick the special ones.
I’m so proud of him and the recognition he has brought to the organization and the city.
The moments with him and AJ at the end of the game will be ones I treasure forever.
MW: I love the fact that he actually smiled.
- T from NYOutside of Roy Halladay, my pick for Jay’s MVP would be Rios.
I know he is frustrating because he makes mental mistakes and people expect him to hit 30+ HRs, but he’s still had a pretty decent season; hitting a bunch of doubles, being a great base stealer, and being one of the best RFs defensively.
Perception is a funny thing. If you asked certain scribes and fans, “Would you trade Rios for Ichiro.” they’d wet themselves at the chance. But at this point, Rios is the better player this year, and going forward.
MW: It’s close, but given their ages and Rios’ power, you’re right. And no one on the Jays has said he wants to punch Rios.
- JasonFor the caller tonight discussing Halladay’s IP.
1 Mark Buehrle 1789.1 2001 2008
2 Livan Hernandez 1777.2 2001 2008
3 Javier Vazquez 1721.2 2001 2008
4 Barry Zito 1706.1 2001 2008
5 Greg Maddux 1684.1 2001 2008
6 Tim Hudson 1678.2 2001 2008
7 Jamie Moyer 1658.1 2001 2008
8 C.C. Sabathia 1650.1 2001 2008
9 Roy Oswalt 1616 2001 2008
10 Jeff Suppan 1582 2001 2008
11 Roy Halladay 1567.2 2001 2008
MW: I figured he wasn’t on top, but you can’t count 2001 unless you start in mid-July. The caller was only referring to 2002-2008.
- GregJPMike,
I was just wondering…if a person wanted to know about rookie eligibility in MLB why wouldn’t they do the following?
1. Fire up computer
2. Load google.ca
3. Type in “MLB rookie eligibility”
4. Load the first site that comes up…
http://www.rauzulusstreet.com/baseball/mlbawards/rookieyr.htm
5. Scroll down the page and read the following
“Additional eligibility requirements were set forth in 1971 with a rookie formally defined as a player with less than 130 at-bats, a pitcher with less than 50 innings pitched, or anyone with less than 45 days on any Major League roster.”
MW: I’m the radio version of google, I guess.
- GregJPVery happy that Roy got number 20. Probably deserved to have won 25. Frankly, amazed the Jays’ offense woke up from their latest slumber and scored 8 runs. They owed Halladay for brutal run support for most of the season.
I don’t think losing Marcum and Burnett should totally deflate the Jays’ chances for next season. JP has to pick up a power bat, a number 2 starting pitcher and a decent number 4 starter, via free-agency or trade. And hope Wells, Rios, Hill, Rolen have healthy and more productive offensive seasons.
Very doable.No excuses to write-off the 2009 season!
MW: Never an excuse to write a season off before the off-season that comes before it.
- Kelly PfeifferMike,
I have a couple coments and one very important question. First off I would like to say I am beyond excited that Cito will be back next year and the same goes for J.P. I think that J.P. has done a very good job and really as you have said a “million” times its not his fault these great hitter are not hitting and I think he should and deserves to be this teams GM. My question is…I’m not sure if I have seen this on past posts but how often do you update the blog in the off season? Im a die hard baseball fan and need some good reading during the winter months and really enjoy the blog.
Just in case I don’t have the chance to say this over the final weekend (shedding a tear over that) but I would just like to thank you on behalf of all Blue Jay fans for your great work and love of OUR Team this year. Looking forward to next year and can’t wait to hear what playoff post games with Mike Wilner sound like next year.
MW: Thanks, I appreciate the kind words. I haven’t decided how often I’ll update the blog in the off-season, but I figure it’ll be around once a week, with posts following any Jays move, of course, and plenty from the winter meetings.
- Chrishey mike;
Great win for the Jays, and Halladay is by far one of the top three pitchers in baseball is is hopefully hall of fame bound after he reaches 200 plus wins, definatly the anchor of the team. Great to see Vernon have a excellent game and show some power. Hope to see bautista and johnny mac in the lineup for the last couple of games, thx for the great blog.
- robert.sIt’s unbelievable to think just how underpaid he is compared to the rest of the league. Can you think of any other contracts in the past 5 years that even approach his from a value perspective?
MW: I assume you’re referring to Halladay. There are tons of contracts that are better values than Halladay’s, but almost all are with players who weren’t yet eligible for free agency when they signed.
- RobHi Mike
What do you know about the baseball world classic? Is it good baseball – worth purchasing tickets for?
I am sad as well the season is coming to an end.
MW: It’s great baseball.
- francis xWhat has happened to Adam Lind? 4 RBI in the last month? Are pitchers reading the book on him or what?
MW: Lind is hitting .267/.294/.305 over the last month, and he hasn’t homered since August 19th. As they say, it’s a game of adjustments, and it’s Lind’s turn to adjust back.
- ZackHey Mike,
Yesterday I sent you a message asking what pitcher or pitchers we should get and you blew me off.. You said you already said it many times.. I said ok fine I misssed out but then a caller calls in and you answer it with no problem.. What gives?
The young pitcher we got from the Stairs deal is he good or is he going to be a bullpen guy and stay in Triple A?
MW: The difference between questions here and questions on the air is, I guess, that there’s no way to “listen back”, and I know that people are tuning in and out throughout the night. Here on the blerg, you can read every day or whenever at your leisure, and you can easily go back to check out stuff that you’ve missed. Basically, if I have to read through 75-100 comments a day, then you do, too. It takes a TON of my own time to do this thing, and I’m not willing to give up more of that time to answer the same question over and over again. As for the minor-leaguer the Jays got for Stairs, assumed to be Fabio Castro, he’s pitched in the bigs before and certainly has a chance to do so again. I don’t get the “is he good or is he going to be a bullpen guy”.
- EddieMike,
I hope you take care of your back.
I know this is going back a couple of posts but what I said about the offense was that it was not good enough to carry a team. Or to put it differently, I do not believe the Jays can slug their way into the playoff race next year. I am more than fine with Halladay, Litsch, Purcey and a healthy McGowan. But I wouldn’t want to bet the farm on McGowan. I trust J.P. will figure somethings out. I give a lot of credit to him for building the team through the year, which is shown in the 2nd half record. Just this time he’ll have to move more pieces in the offseasn.
Man we are spoil with the Doc on call ever 5 days.
MW: I don’t think the Jays can slug their way into the race next year either, as currently constituted.
- JWHi Mike,
There is no other pitcher I want on the mound,in MLB today, in an important game other than Roy Halladay.
Are we sure he is not a robot?
Thanks, Mike.
MW: I wasn’t sure until he smiled.
- JeffIt’s hilarious to think that rumours are still floating around that the Jays might shop Halladay around. That would be like the Fox network deciding to fire Hugh Laurie from House. Yeah, probably not.
I do hope that Halladay does use whatever influence he might have with AJ Burnett to try and convince him to stay in Toronto for less money. They do seem to be great friends, and the Doc has to know that the Jays would be better with AJ than without him.
MW: I don’t think that matters, but I’ll be pleasantly surprised if it does.
- GrrbearMike,
I mentioned the other day Rolen could hit 20Hrs if he is healthy, you didn’t seem to think so. But Cito Gaston mentioned him (reported on the broadcast) as a guy that could and needs to for this team to be sucessfull next year. Also he mentioned Travis Snider in that group, so sounds like he is penciled in for next year unless he completely falls off the table. Whenever the Jays have put up some runs lately Snider has been right in the middle of it. If the Jays can land a legitimate proven DH, then I trade Adam Lind and a couple throw in’s for a solid middle rotation pitcher.
MW: Cito has said a couple of times that he thinks Rolen could hit 20 next year, and I believe that he believes that. But Rolen has only managed 20 once in the last four seasons and this season and last has combined for just 19, so I need to see it to believe it. Yes, we think Rolen is healthy now, but we thought that in January, too.
- DennyAnd Rolen has now hit 4Hrs since returning Aug 29th, less than a month. Not trying to show you up, just that he is showing alot of promise for next year (fingers crossed)
MW: Somehow I got it in my head that the homer he hit the other night was only his second since coming back.
- DennyMike, I’m wondering if the Jays and Indians might be able to get together on a deal this off-season?
The Indians need a closer, which the Jays could probably provide (Ryan??) and they may have an extra catcher available (Martinez or Shoppach). I realize that with only Fasano available on their 40-man roster, they might not be willing to deal V-Mart or Shoppach, but do they have anyone in the minors that might be ready to be a back-up?
Or, maybe we could throw Zaun into the deal as well, to give them a credible back-up.
If such a deal might be doable, would you prefer V-Mart (coming off his injury-plagued year, but with a history of power — career .298/.370/.462) or Shoppach (2 years younger, appears to have good potential — this year .263/.347/.523)?
MW: With Arencibia and Jeroloman on their way up, the Jays aren’t going to be looking to add a starting catcher in the off-season.
- NormA real crowd pleaser tonight, you couldn’t ask for a better way to end the season at home, unless of course halladay’s twentieth completed a sweep or at least a series win against the yanks.
Anyway, a buddy and I discussed this whilst at tonight’s ballgame: do the jays make like like the then tampa bay devil rays and look to trade rios this offseason like the rays did with delmon young to try and bring in a quality arm similar in productiveness to matt garza?
Stick the kids lind and snider in the corners and be content wit a decent number two or three starter? What are your thoughts mike, cheers
p.s. Congrats on another great season of broadcasting by yourself, jerry, allan, and the rest of the team.
MW: I think that the Jays will explore the possibility of trading Rios or Adam Lind for a good starting pitcher, much like they did last winter.
- Pat S.“The Doc is a true gem. Too bad he can only go every fifth day. The Jays could use a true superstar like that on the field and in the lineup every day.
Coming from a city whose soccer club always had one bona fide superstar in its lineup and lost every year, I’m here to tell you one is not enough.
MW: There’s no comparison.
- reyesMike
Hope the back gets feelin better.Maybe they should have let you join Tabby and Jamie in the Comfort Zone.
Doc puts in another vintage Doc performance to get 20.Good thing the bats came back from the dead to support him.If not for those starts where Both Doc and AJ pitched a gem (And Marcum for that matter) and received no run support,it’s conceivable that Doc could be at about 24 wins and AJ at least 22.
I’ve been reading alot of stories/blogs about folks being upset about JP coming back.However,if this team just played .500 ball in April/June and executed in those totally winable games with RISP things may be different.Not once in those games did I see JP stand at home plate and watch strike 2@3 go by with the bat on his shoulder.What happened to the art of the sac fly? I am not exactly trying to defend him but JP’s not the reason the Jays get October off.
I listen to him on your show and sometimes get annoyed with his comments but I respect the fact he comes on and says what he feels.This is much preferable to someone who doesn’t come on or someone who just says what the fans want to hear.
He may not be the best GM out there,but is in my opinion a decent one.FACTS ARE FACTS:the difference between the Jays and the Tampa Bay Rays this season is the Rays executed when they need to all season and the Jays waited until the second half.All in all this club is closer than some might think and hopefully those voids can get filled in the offseason.
Keep up the good work Mike,I enjoy Jays talk and sorry about the rambling post but I just felt it had to be said.
MW: Compared to a lot of the comments I get here, you didn’t ramble at all.
- TerryHey Mike,
Sure Roy is good, but he still couldn’t beat Chicago or Boston when it absolutely mattered at the most this season. He has 20 wins now, that will look real good to a team that will contend next season. Why don’t we trade Roy, when his value is at his peak. Lets face it, this group of players doesn’t have it to win. I love Cito, he could be my manager for the next 10 years, but we have to change the makeup of the team.
When is it time to give up on the core ? 2010? Why should the fans continue to accept satisfactory results ?
MW: Your first sentence destroys your credibility.
- PeteMike:
Just a note on Overbay (and possibly an explanation why he receives a lot of flak):
He’s hitting .385/.438/.538 in 16 PA with the bases loaded–sounds pretty clutch doesn’t it?
It’s not.
Six of those plate appearances occurred in innings 1-6 of games and he went 4-for-6 with a double and hit into one double play (.667/.667/.833).
In the seventh inning or later (10 PA) Overbay is .143/.300/.143 with three GiDP. His two bases loaded walks came in Jays’ blowout wins, two of this three double plays came in a crucial game situation (down 3-2 in the tenth to Seattle; tied 5-5 in the seventh against Cincinnati … both games the Jays lost). He also had a flyout in the 10th inning of a 4-4 game against Minnesota that Toronto would later come back and win and of course, he had the much debated called third strike in the eighth inning against the Yankees back on the 23rd.
It took until September 11 against Chicago before he got his first post-seventh inning bases loaded hit (in the Jays six-run eighth). His only other productive PA was a run-scoring sac fly in the ninth against the Orioles that was part of a Jays’ walkoff win in July (I think that may have been the Jays first walk off of the year).
While it’s most likely a sample size fluke–that’s a fair number of memorable failures. Especially in a season where Toronto (1) had trouble scoring runs (2) lost a lot of close games. After all, it’s hard not to forget a late inning, close game bases loaded situation since they’re edge-of-your-seats time moments and have probably created a subconscious impression that he “always fails” in big moments. Let’s face it–one hit (a single) in ten chances with the bases loaded late in a ball game can make an impression regardless of how fair the perception is.
No need to post this–I don’t want to give the irrational Overbay-haters any ammunition but I thought it might provide an insight why so many have been hard on him this year.
On a happier note–it was nice to see Roy take charge in getting win No. 20 and doing it in style. Hopefully the big 2-0 will get enough of the BBWAA’s attention to get Halladay at least second place in CYA voting. It’d be a travesty (and not the first it should be noted) if F-Rod finished ahead of him because of all his shiny saves.
Take care of the back–I’ve been suffering from spinal problems since a nasty truck accident in 1991. It’s well worth the effort to be proactive in dealing with it.
Best Regards
John
MW: I know you said no need to post this, but I wanted to because it does illustrate an important fact – how a small number of large failures can impact on the overall perception of a person. The opposite, as you mention, is trutaro as well.
- John B.Not only did we get to see Halladay win his 20th, Mussina got to see it too!
MW: Hopefully it’s the last time Mussina gets to see someone pick up his 20th win this season.
- BradleyHey Mike,
So much for the relentless efforts of a certain baseball writer to have JP Ricciardi run out of Toronto on a rail. Those efforts deserved to fail. JP is staying and I for one am glad.
Like it or not, Rogers and Jays’ fans have made an investment in JP over the years. The man is still young and is still learning the craft. He could use a dose of humility but that’s hardly uncommon in GMs.
I believe a level of humility and self-deprecating humour will come with maturity.
He’s a better GM now than he was when he got here and gets a bit smarter every season. Do we really want to ditch him now? Someone else will get him after his education is ready to bear fruit.
Be patient fans! Our time will come again and I firmly believe JP will be part of it.
marcuspeaks
MW: It’s not just one writer.
- marcGlad to see J.P. will be back. I’ll take Roy Halliday’s opinion of J.P. (“I think we’ve gone in some good directions and I’ve always trusted J.P. …”) over those of the so-called media experts, primarily the Prime Time Sports fraternity.
- k.alanI do criticize the Jays, both thier perfomance and how the team is run, when I feel it is warranted. Contrary to what you have said in the past, which is “anyone who critcizes the jays doesn’t like baseball”, I do consider myself a Jays fan and big ball fan in general. But the one thing that will change my support of the Jays, regardless of my critism/opinion, is if they ever let Doc leave. I don’t catch every single game they play, but I do make a concerted effort to watch what I think is the best in the game, much like I did when Clemens was here. The difference in my eyes between Clemens and Doc, is Doc has been here from the get go and not brought in as a hired gun. As a fan, and probably as a baseball executive I am sure, there is a little more attachment to a guy that has come up through the system. I don’t care what is offered for Halladay, I don’t ever trade him. I definitely dont let him walk as a free agent either. Every effort should be made to ensure he retires as a Jay. Some guys cannot be replaced and I think it will be some time before we see another man with Halladay’s combination of ability, character and work ethic. When he leaves, so do I. Hope it never happens!! Ah , who am I kidding, I’ll always be a jays fan, I’ll just be even more bitter.
MW: You’ll have to show me where I ever said that anyone who criticizes the Jays doesn’t like baseball.
- Thomamike,
- darrell bishopjust an observation i had
after being down at the park last night.
giambi comes to the plate and the fans boo him (almost) like he’s derek jeter. showing no love whatsoever. which is obviously ok, we all have that right as a fan.
but the only reason i bring it up is… i was in n.y. for burnett’s last start there this yr. when he left the game, the one thing that stuck with me was how generous the yankee fans were with their applause for him as he left the mound.
anyway, you probably know where i’m going with this.. they could dearly use him next yr. as we could giambi.
even the yankee fans it seems know how to play this game don’t they……
and one aside, i sit right down at 3rd base for the home games. have to tell you, i don’t care what troy’s doing or not doing in st. louis, i love everything about scott rolen as a ball player. and i know you like him in that regard as well.
here’s hoping he can stay healthy and contribute for the the coming yrs. cause for my money, the way he conducts himself he desrves it.
later.
Mike, I am glad you support the idea for the Jays Care Foundation. Would you be able to run the idea by Jerry and Allan and give me an update? The three of you in a pic, all autographed. I think this could really work. Heck, I’ll take two! Thanks Mike.
- Jamie/WindsorRoy Halliday reaching number #20 this year is only 1 of the 3 strong wishes I had for September. #1 was Jays making the playoffs and #2 was Tom Cheek getting and overwhelming number of Frick votes for the HOF. At least I have a shot at 2 out of 3. I’ve got approx 20 votes in so far for Tom.
I’m disappointed the Jays bats slumped back to early May mode since the Boston series. Even if they came up short on the wild card I was really hoping they could get to 90 wins. Still the Jays can end the season with more wins than at least 1 playoff team.
If the Yankees are serious about lobbying for a change in playoff format, the Jays should jump on that wagon.
MW: 90 wins was a pretty big pipe dream. It would have required a 20-6 September.
- Ian CMike,
I just want to let you know that I have greatly enjoyed reading the blog this year.
You do an outstanding job on it with stats and general information.
I was wondering if Roy Halladay has a chance of passing Dave Stieb’s club record of 174 wins (I think that I am right on the number).
What is his contract status.
Sorry I won’t get to hear Jerry, Alan and you anymore this season. (I only get XM home team feed)
Best wishes for the off-season.
Jayzfan
MW: Halladay’s contract expires after the 2010 season – if he re-signs, and the Jays will make every effort to make sure he does, he has an excellent chance of breaking Stieb’s club record of 175. And hey, you can listen online here on the website, to the post-game, at least.
- keith banksI was looking at Doc’s performance over the season and I noticed that he has factored in every decision except for three, and one of them was coming on in relief of a game in Philly. That’s 31/33 starts that he has picked up a win or loss. That’s got to be a record for highest rate of factoring into a decision, if that record even exists.
MW: I would think that there are a few pitchers who have picked up a decision in every start they’ve made over the 100+ years of this great game.
- KristianI’m looking all over the place but I can not find: VOTE FOR TOM CHEEK!!! DETAILS AND LINK AT THE BOTTOM OF THE POST!!!!!
Maybe my browser is not setup to see the above. Could you have a link or button put on the FAN590 main page with big red >>. THX.
MW: There’s a link at the bottom of each post, but there’s also one on the front page of the website.
- Brian RoweMike,
Has Travis Schneider played his was on to this roster for next year?
Would a pitcher of consequence sign a 1 or 2 year contract because the Jays can’t be interested in pitching past ’09 or ’10.
Also, with the dire pitching situation, is there any choice but to keep JP? It doesn’t seem likely that they would bring in a new GM in what looks to be a loosing situation next season, and another loosing season will make it easier to fire JP and even JP’s most staunch supporter will have to consider doing the same thing. Your thoughts?
MW: There’s only one “o” in losing – you’re hardly the only one to make that mistake, though. Snider may well have played his way onto the roster for next year, mostly because the Jays may have to shift their spending to the mound, but he certainly hasn’t done anything to indicate he shouldn’t be given a shot. You’re very right about J.P., there was nothing to be gained in the Jays firing him this off-season.
- ChrisIt’s widely accepted (rightly or wrongly)that the word “loyalty” is not listed in the dictionary used by athletes. Regarding Burnett’s situation, the Jays’ gave him a nice contract that had many so- called baseball “Einsteins” snickering. Although he has the option to walk away, a little of that aforementioned loyalty would surely show that he’s grateful.But maybe the word grateful is also missing from that same dictionary.
MW: The word “loyalty” is not listed in the dictionary used by owners, either.
- chrisIf doc has another doc-like season next year, do you think he will end up being the best pitcher of this decade?
MW: There’ll still be a year left in the decade, but wow, that’s a good question. Off the top of my head, I’d say probably.
- TerryDoc is the man, now if Ted opens the vault & signs A.J. it will show they really are trying to win, please lets say adios to Lyle & Marco, we need someone that can drive in runs, remember all those games they could’ve won& all those runners stranded.
MW: Yeah, those were all Overbay and Scutaro’s faults.
- don trowellHello Mike,
I called in Jays Talk Thur night. I called to report I had just seen a prank version on the Blue Jays ‘Born to play’ commercials. It was the one where young Roy Halliday is throwing his Brussels sprouts out the kitchen window. However, instead of his mother turning around and saying ‘Good work Roy you ate all your vegetables’. This time it was Vernon wells in drag with a blond wig, dress and lip stick. When he said ‘Good work Roy you ate all your vegetables’. The kid was just sitting there staring in shock with his mouth open.
No I wasn’t hallucinating, as you so quickly assumed and commented on. It was my 10 year old daughter that yelled out ‘Look it’s Vernon Wells’.
They only played the version once right around the 8th inning. Nobody seems to be mentioning it. I’m really intrigued to see how it got on air. It was definitely a laugh but was obviously not shared with many viewers. Would appreciate if you asked someone in the Jays organization about it?
MW: I’m really sorry about that. I have heard enough about that commercial to know it was legit, but when I heard your call I thought that you were just kidding around. I’ll have to ask around about that.
- MikeHey Mike,
It’s probably been said 10,000 times so let me make it 10,001: Roy Halladay is (to quote DJF) “nails”. I know he was facing mostly the B-lineup last night, but some pitchers can lose focus in that situation. Uh, not Roy. He was locked in from the start, aside from the 1st and 3rd with nobody out wobble in the fifth, which he calmly escaped with the ole GDP and the final out, shutting down what could have been a large inning. After that he boa constrictered (not exactly a word, but that’s how it felt all the way from the 500 level) the Yankees the rest of the way.
We are truly privileged to be able to watch him (the athlete) perform every fifth day and to have him (the man) on this team. Go ahead and stick your heads in the sand and bitch and moan about missing the playoffs again, I’ll just marvel at this guy and hope the offseason brings maybe a $120 million payroll (?) and a chance to get this thoroughbred where he belongs…um playoffs?
Some Jays fans remind me of spoiled children. From 1985 to 1993 this town ruled the baseball world (the Jays weren’t bad in ’83 and ’84 either). Then, as all good things do (unless you have a payroll budget larger than the GDP of most countries and even then…heh, heh, couldn’t resist), the run ended and half of the fan base dropped away. Yeah, the strike turned a lot of people off, but it’s not like it robbed the team of a threepeat or anything. Imagine being an Expos fan. Now that’s a pi**er.
Where some others find doom and gloom with this team, I see signs of them getting back on the baseball map again. I’m not blind or stupid, I know the offense struggled (sucked craptacularly?) this year and last year, but look at the young (read: cheap), talented pitching that keeps coming up. Look at the best defense in the league. If this team gets a league average level of runs per game on offense, they’ll be right in the thick of it, provided they scour the pitching market for one solid and one decent starting pitcher and add another solid (preferably big and scary, but those can be awfully pricey) bat to put somewhere in the middle of the order.
This is the make or break offseason. It has to go something like the offseason between ’05 and ’06 (who knows maybe we’ll get Allan James again – at more money for sure, but Roy and him at the top of the rotation feels a lot more comfortable, although…new contract=more injuries?) when the Jays took over the winter meetings. I’m looking forward to it, as much as one looks forward to the offseason. Unlike so many who want to ride J.P. out on the rails so fast his head will spin, I think he’s done a good job baseball-wise.
The only complaint I have is his public relations skills. That area definitely needs polishing. It makes for good copy for the press and he doesn’t go for the easy cliche, but sometimes as a (almost, I was 7) day 1 supporter of this team, I wish he’d take the high road and avoid the heat of the street fight, which as we have seen (repeatedly) only causes bad blood, and comes back to bite him almost instantaneously with that Interweb thingy. I think he’s demonstrated a solid learning curve as a baseball general manager, hopefully he’ll show a similar one on the public relations front. Should somebody with more experience have been brought in during 2001 offseason? Maybe, but that’s so long ago, please let’s not re-hash it now.
Is it going to continue to be difficult in the AL East? Uh, yeah. Now that the Yankees can leverage their new cathedral with the ever-important (CHA-CHING) luxury boxes, not to mention inane ticket, concession and souvenir prices, I don’t think a $300 million payroll can be that far off. Tampa Bay should be solid for the next decade or so and the Red Sox don’t appear to be going away anytime soon. But I remember the moaning and wailing about how tough the AL East was in the ’70′s and ’80′s and eventually this team had its turn at greatness and it will again. 5 times in 9 seasons? Probably not, but it sounds like everyone here would settle for 1, like as in yesterday. It’ll come and when it does it’ll be all the sweeter for the desert that has existed since ’94.
Speaking of playoffs, did anybody else feel the atmosphere in the building last night? It was nice to be part of the Doc love-in and to realize how much fun it will be when this team gets there again. Thanksgiving’s coming for us in Canada. In regards to this team, let’s try to be thankful for what we have, rather than bemoaning and bellyaching over what we don’t have, OK?
For those of you who can’t do that and live in the Toronto area and are Leafs fans, well you’ve got that to look forward to now. I will never understand how everyone blasts every other sports team in this town, but the Leafs are raised to cult-like status, despite fielding easily the craptacularist (also not a word, but very descriptive, non?) team of all of them bar none. Sorry for the hockey reference Mike, but sometimes you’ve just gotta say: “What the ****?”
Happy (Forgive me if that’s not the right word for such a reflective and introspective time. I suppose it would be kind of like wishing me a Happy Good Friday, before I went all agnostic. I just wanted to recognize them.) High Holy Days from September 30 (Rosh Hashanah) to October 9 (Yom Kippur) to you and your family Mike. Take care and I’m looking forward to your Blue Jay-a-day pre-game show coverage throughout the playoffs. Hopefully, one of these years, the boys will have baseball to play instead of the big show, but in the meantime,
- Tom the InternNever mind researching the Vernon Wells commercial. There is a whole discussion about it on BlueJays.com.
Suggest you see it. Either Vernon has a good sense of humor! Or we were all hallucinating? You decide.
MW: I’d like to see it.
- MikeHi Mike,
which stat do you think is more surprising and season defining -
a- Vernon Well misses a third of the year and finishes 4th in team AB’s
b-Marco Scutaro finishes 3rd in team AB’s
thanks
MW: I’d say B is more season-defining.
- Bob from GuelphMW: The fact that you think losing Izturis and Lopez were big mistakes sheds serious doubts on your credibility. You do realize, as well, that Delgado leaving had nothing to do with Ricciardi, right?
Mike,
I did not say “big mistakes”. Big mistakes were Adams and Hill as first round picks, Hinske, Tosca, Gibbons etc.
The fact that we still do not have a viable middle-infield says that letting them go was a mistake. Izturis played well for the Dodgers after he lect here.
Also if Delgado’s leaving wasn’t Ricciardi’s doing, whose was it?
MW: Hill wasn’t a mistake, never mind a big mistake, and Hinske wasn’t a big mistake, either. Tosca and Gibbons were unproven but had great track records. You saying again that Izturis played well for the Dodgers doesn’t make it true. Delgado’s leaving was due to the payroll available to the Jays at the time, so blame Rogers for that.
- Cito ManWhat SS/DH combo would you rather have for next year (I’m not suggesting either is probable)
1) Furcal and Snider
2) Scutaro and Ibanez
MW: If I had to pick one, I’d take the latter, I think.
- Jay MoneyMike – I appologize if this stuff has already been discussed. I listen to your show a lot, but can’t catch every minute.
It would appear to me, based on Scutaro being played at SS every day lately, and based on JP comments the other night, that he is next years SS, barring a trade, leaving Johny Mac as a backup infielder. I guess they are seeing how good Scutes defense is?
Secondly, since Jays are now out of playoff contention, why is Thigpen not playing everyday right now given that he is possible backup catcher next year and Zaun is gone???
Thirdly, it doesnt seem possible that our top 5 bullpen guys (BJ, Accardo, Jansen, Downs, League), assuming they are all healthy, can possibly get enough work to warrant them being all being in the pen, especially since we still have Carlson, Tallet, Wolfe, Fraser? etc etc. Perhaps someone could be converted to starter ?? I know Jansen and Downs have been discussed, but what about the others ?? Fraser hardly ever pitches, perhaps starting could resurrect his career? Perhaps sign him to Syracuse contract to make him into a starter? Wolfe? Tallet same???
Thanks Mike, love your show.
MW: You don’t listen to every minute? You’d better get to work on that. 1 – I think they’ve decided they like Scutaro more than Mac. 2 – Good question. 3 – Janssen and Downs are the likeliest to be given a shot to start.
- RandyIn the 2010 offseason what kind of contract will Roy Halladay be looking for and what other “ACE” type pitchers are available.
MW: I have no idea who will be a free agent after 2010 (beyond several Blue Jays). I would assume Halladay would command top dollar.
- Justin Jaysi think we need to trade doc.
we could get a boatload of value for doc. only 2 yrs left on his deal. it would hurt to do it, but it is hard to imagine his value getting higher than it is right now. what do you think MW?
MW: If trading Roy Halladay would make this team likelier to win in the next two years, then the Jays should do it.
- kurt kThe Doc is “the man”. No denying that. Ant predictions on the World Series this year Mike?
I’m going with Angels-Brewers with the Brewers taking it in six. Provided Sheets’arm holds together…
MW: What would make you think that was possible?
- Brad WHey Mike
I was wondering what happened to a few formwer Jays. Royce Clayton, Jason Phillips and Josh Towers.
Thanks
MW: None of them played in the majors this year – Towers got lit up in AAA for the Rockies.
- PaulImagine life after Doc?..In 2011 the Jays will owe Wells 23M, Rios 12m, Hill 5M..That is 40% of this years payroll on 3 players…How are they going to be able to fork out about 15-20M a season for Halladay?..Ok say 20M for Halladay..Thats about 59M spent on 4 players..
2010 is the last year we will see this guy..Guaranteed..
MW: Willing to bet the house?
- gumpMike,
As recently as 2 weeks ago, you said that Giambi was a likely guy that the Jays would target. I have heard you mention his name many times this year. Now you say that the Jays probably don’t have the cash to sign him after the year he has had. But he was having the same year a couple of weeks ago when you were still mentioning his name all the time. Why do you suddenly think the Jays can’t afford him?
MW: Because now they have to put way more of their money towards starting pitching.
- LanceI am so happy the “battle” for 3rd place is over.
Honestly, Mike, you were the only person on the planet who cared if the Jays finished 3rd. I have great respect for your baseball knowledge and so do many of my friends, but you made yourself into a laughingstock the way you were carrying on about 3rd place. All of my friends could not believe how many times you would keep mentioning it, why did you care so much? It’s not like the Yanks were at full strength. No Wang or Posada the whole year, not to mention a slew of other injuries. I would understand being proud of finishing higher than the Yanks if they had their best lineup all season with no major injuries, but that has not happened this year.
The Rockets won the NBA title in 1994 and ’95. Only one problem, Jordan was retired those 2 years. Mike, if you played on those teams, would you consider yourself a true champion even though you didn’t beat the best to win? When Jordan came back, the Rockets didn’t sniff another title.
It’s a sad state of affairs when you are leading the cheers for a third place finish. I guess after so many crappy years of Jays baseball, that is all you have to cling to.
MW: I haven’t led any cheers for third place, but I would like to see the Jays finish ahead of the Yankees. You’re right, beating them when they’re not at full strength doesn’t count, because the Jays have had their full line-up all season long. I’m sure people in Houston are very happy with those two championships.
- KenWith all things considered (including the cost to obtain the latter), who do you prefer at first base for the Blue Jays? Overbay, or Jacobs of the Marlins?
MW: Overbay.
- BrendanCongrats to Cito for his 50th win.
Cito: 50-36
Gibbons: 35-39
A world of difference!
- BeburgHi Mike,
I was at this game. Although the Jays are out of it I still loved it and there was a good atmosphere. It was a good experience and I cant wait to enjoy watching Bluejays baseball in 2009!
- Warren“Calling all respiratory techs”…Major tracheotomy needed at Shea Stadium….25 guys choking at once..Same time last year..Must be something in the air in Queens in late September?..or is it a bad case of Billy Wagneritis
MW: It has nothing to do with Billy Wagner.
- chriswell halladay is something else this was a great pitching performance he just does it so many times you expect it all the time from this guy. jaystalk is awesome i listen to it everynight and listening 2 jerry and allen is great too bad my parents turn of the radio before the show is over great job! hopefully a playoff season coming up i like jp and cito together plaoffs are going to be coming very soon
MW: Stop letting your parents turn the radio off!
- NoleHey Mike,
I know you’ve mentioned Pedro and Pavano as some of the options you’d like the Jays to explore as a lightning in a bottle type low-cost veteran pitcher.
What about Brad Penny?
The Dodgers bought out the last year of his contract for $2M, as opposed to keeping him for his $9.25M option, which means they probably won’t be offering him arbitration either (because it would be roughly the same amount of money if he accepts).
What are your thoughts on the Jays going after him?
He’s got an injury history, but is only 30 years of age, and has been relatively healthy the during his time in LA with the exception of this season.
1 year, $5M base with incentives up to $8M wouldn’t be a bad idea for a guy who has a career 94-75 record, 4.06 ERA. Bring him in with the intention of being a #3-4 type guy. He’s looking for short-term contract to rebuild his value, and the Jays need a bridge to 2010. Plus, like AJ, he’s familiar with Arnsberg from their days in Florida.
JP was rumoured to be interested in him back in ’06.
Think it would be a good avenue to explore?
MW: Maybe, but I’m not convinced that he’ll be healthy, and the last thing the Jays need is to sign a free-agent pitcher to a reasonable deal and then have him drop, too.
- Alex from MississaugaDoc is a master of his craft but only having 2 more seasons he is under contract has me a little uncomfortable myself considering the frustration he expressed,what do you think the jays are gonna have to offer Doc to keep him beyond 2010?
MW: Lots of money. But I think they will, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he re-upped before Opening Day 2009.
- RoyceDid I just see Benjie Molina get pinch run for in the middle of a homerun? I mean I know he’s slow but this is ridiculous. Anyway Mike, my picks are an all LA World Series. And that’s based on want. I get off work 10pm every night. If you don’t hear from me again, then thank you for another wonderful season of Jays Talk. You lead the league again this year. The off-season acquisition of the blog was huge. JP was money every 7th day. You also should be applauded for never missing a start in those day games after all night extras and the nasty doubleheaders. I’m praying every night for the Jays Talk show on Sportsnet next year. Thanks again.
MVP: Mr Mike Wilner
ROY: Miked Up
Play of the Year: The Downsy text message.
MW: My pleasure, and thanks for the awards!
- SpiderSilva” Tosca and Gibbons were unproven but had great track records. ”
One rookie could be forgiven. Two can’t be forgiven. Please don’t bother to try and convince me that Ricciardi hired rookies because he thought they would really, really work out. He hired rookies he thought would really, really do as he told them to do onfield and off. The only bright spark on the horizon for me going into next year is the fact that this time it’s Cito Gaston who is manager. And I believe it’s been made abundantly clear to Ricciarid that Cito Gaston will make his own decisions onfield, and will have a whopping big say in what goes on off the field. The days of Ricciardi micro-management are over. That, at least, is a blessing.
MW: I’ll never understand why there’s a belief that the person who puts the team together should simply present what he’s built to someone else and then just watch.
- reyes“The opposite, as you mention, is trutaro as well.”
Touché!
Well played.
Anyway, it would be interesting to know whether Halladay has spoken to Burnett about returning. I don’t think that it’s right for anybody to expect A.J. to not exercise the opt out or at the very least parlay it into more money. It was negotiated, it has financial value and should not be relinquished without compensation.
While folks keep saying it wasn’t Burnett’s best year, I think a case can be made that he probably enjoyed one of his best seasons of his career. He finished with a career high in innings pitched and combined with his strikeouts and his 106 ERA+ (factoring in strength of opposition; a 2.73 ERA in 132 IP against the Angels, Red Sox, Cubs, White Sox, Twins, Yankees, Phillies and Rays) makes it probably his second best year to date.
I’d have to check, but I think he may have had his finest run over his final 19 starts: a whisker under seven innings pitched, a 2.8 BB/9 a 9.8 K/9 with an ERA of 3.12 with four starts against the Yankees, three starts against the Red Sox, two against the Rays and one versus the Angels, Twins and White Sox.
That’s 14 starts against some tough foes–before folks discount the Yankee games, he and Halladay are a big reason they’re staying home this year; they inflicted eight losses on the Bronx Bombers.
It’s almost like they were “brothers-in-arms” this season and one has to wonder if (1) Halladay was a positive influence on him and (2) how much value that has to Burnett.
It’d be nice it he stays (I think–I worry about his arm) but after seeing watching them interact after their final respective starts it does make one wonder.
Still, it was nice to see Burnett celebrate Halladay’s 20th win along with him. As I said, “brothers-in-arms” … you might give props to A.J. for being willing to “salute-a-bro‘.”
(I hope Vizzini isn’t around … heh).
Best Regards
John
- John B.“It’d be nice it he stays (I think–I worry about his arm) but after seeing watching them interact after their final respective starts it does make one wonder.”
Somewhere Yogi is laughing.
Best Regards
John
MW: I’m not sure Yogi would have gotten that far.
- John B.Mike;
I’m 14, and a huge Jay fan. I have a couple points and a couple questions.
Question: 1) Would you make the Rios/ Lincecum deal? or Rios/ Cain? Using hindsight would you keep Rios (since he led the team in almost every offensive category) on a team in desperate need of power, or hitting in general. I would still make the deal, because, with a definite number 2 starter (behind Halladay) the Jays would be able to trade AJ during the season, (by the way do I hear word of an extension $30mil/ two yrs?). They would have a cheap #2 for at least a couple years in Lincecum or Cain. The smart thing to do (instead of signing Shannon Stewart) would be to keep Reed Johnson, who, “is the dirty type of player that we like”. Bring up Adam Lind for the entire season to see what he could do ( even Travis Snyder later in the season if they needed him) to platoon in left.
Question: 2)
do you remember a caller that said that he had a “source” that told him there would be an AJ and Rios for Matt Holliday before the trade deadline?
Point : 1) You probably have this info, but I’d like to get it out there, the Jays draft choices compared to the Red Sox. I know that the MLB draft is a crap-chute but this is kind of disturbing.
Bos
Draft Results
2002
Jonathan T Lester
Brandon D Moss
Brian P Bannister
2003
David M Murphy
Matthew H Murton
Jonathan R Papelbon
2004
Dustin L. Pedroia
Olise Cla. Meredith
Steven W. Pearce
2005
Clay D Buchholz
Craig R Hansen
Jed Lowrie
Jacoby M Ellsbury
Pedro M Alvarez 08 First round Pick
Allan C Dykstra 08 First Round Pick
2006
Justin D Masterson
Kyle R Snyder
Matthew V Laporta (was main piece of a package for CC)
COMPARED TO:
Tor
2002
RUSS ADAMS
DAVID BUSH
2003
Aaron W Hill
Joshua C Banks
Shaun Marcum
James J Vermilyea
Thomas R Mastny
Ryan Roberts
2004
Zachary T Jackson
David K Purcey
Curtis B Thigpen
Adam A Lind
Robert C Janssen
2005Ricardo Romero
2006
Travis Snider
Can you discuss this? ^^
Point: 2)
He picked Romero over Tulowitzki
because he thought Russ Adams, No. 1 in 2002 could play SS, which led to
having to go get Eckstein, which did not work out, which led to banging Reed
Johnson and signing Shannon Stewart. Trading Quantrill was a mistake for
Prokopec in ’02 when he could have had Gagne from the Dodgers. Look at his
every day lineup and who is still there:
C _ Zaun, now a back up (probably more likely released) , Eckstein gone, 3B Rolen has not been as good as
Glaus, Shannon Stewart in LF released, DH Thomas released. They paid him $8
M for what 60 ABs?
1B _ Overbay is still there, CF Wells, RF Rios still there.
2B _ Hill is hurt, no one’s fault
He has about the same average acquiring the right players a the Jays average hitting with runners in scoring position early in the season.
MW: That’s way too much stuff to go over, and I find it interesting that you give credit to the Red Sox for players they drafted but didn’t sign, and who subsequently went back in the draft. I would definitely still make the Lincecum for Rios deal, as I said I would have back in December when it was being floated and it was about 50-50 among the fans/commenters as to whether or not they wanted to see it happen. Lind wasn’t available to platoon in left at the beginning of the year because Matt Stairs was here, and I’m not getting into the Reed thing again. Jeez, it’s like they released Babe Ruth.
- Bradley BedfordI’m thinking if this team isn’t competing for something over the next few years, Halladay won’t want to play here anymore..Why would he?..It could be 12 years in Toronto and not one meaningful game played in September..By 2010, it will be Year 9 of Riccardi’s 5 year plan..
He’ll be 33yrs old in 2010 and would have earned more then 80 million bucks..His next few contracts should earn him at least another 80 mil..He can pick and choose where he wants to play and he won’t be signing any extensions in Toronto unless he sees progress..
Rios, Wells and Hill have contracts through 2011..Overbay, Downs, Marcum, Mcgowan will command bigger bucks to keep them here..
If the Jays struggle next season, Halladay may be gone..With Riccardi in charge, that is a real possibility..
MW: Sigh.
- gumpMike, re #56 — it may indeed be a case of Billy Wagneritis, with the primary symptom being that Billy Wagner is disabled and unable to shore up that awful pen!
MW: If that’s what Billy Wagneritis means, then sure.
- NormHi Mike,
Ive seen lots of signs for Rochelle Wilner across the city. Any relations?
MW: She’s my father’s wife.
- WarrenAt least the Sox took the right players in the draft! (not the second coming of Chuck Knoblauch.
After all, who would want to take a stud left handed pitcher (kazmir or hamels) in the first round?! Maybe an outfielder in Jeff Francoeur or James Loney… Matt Cain was still available when they took Russ Adams.
Would it be possible to have Halladay, Lincecum, Cain, McGowan, and Marcum?!? Or would they not have brought up Marcum or McGowan?
No Rios, but they would have a staff with an ace and four #2s.
I’m not saying the Reed Johnson is Babe Ruth, but he would has more RBIs than Stairs/Stewart, and a higher batting average.
How would you compare Gord Ash’s tenure to JP’s? Care to comment my second point?
MW: It’s very easy to go back over a draft six years after it happened. Why don’t the Blue Jays have Albert Pujols (13th round), Brandon Webb (10th round), Grady Sizemore (3rd round), Russ Martin (17th round) and Jason Bay (22nd round)? Yes, I know that they weren’t all drafted in the same year, but that’s beside the point. Where were you in 2000 ripping on Gord Ash for letting Bay get through 21 times, or the year before, letting Pujols get by him 12 times?
- Bradley BedfordWhy would I rip on Gord Ash for letting those guys go? HE wasn’t the one doing the scouting. He trusted his scouts, like Tim Wilken (from 96-00). I would put most of the blame on him (wilken) and the rest of the scouting department. If you think that someone as good as Bay or Pujols should’ve been on a GM’s personal radar, then wouldn’t they be on every other GM’s personal radar?
JP on the other hand is very hands on. That’s why it’s appropriate to blame him for the early round mistakes, since they were “his picks”.
Of the first 20 picks in the 2002 draft, two have been in the Bigs. One of them he traded along with two other prospects for his current first basemen.
2003 was better, he took Marcum and Hill (second year in a row he took a SS in the first round).
2004 , four of the players have been a part of the Jays MLB club.
But if you want to know where I was, I was six, and I thought Mike Hampton and Derek Jeter were going to be great players for many years to come. Guess I was half right.
MW: You were half-right, indeed. I don’t think you’re giving the Jays’ scouting department nearly enough credit.
- Bradley BedfordOkay, but how would you compare JP’s eight seasons to Ash’s seven? If you were to grade the offense, defense, starting pitching, relievers, and farm system what would each GM’s grade be?
MW: That’s WAY too much work.
- Bradley BedfordForgot to ask,
Would you take a flyer on Rafael Furcal?
He’s a leadoff hitter and shortstop that the Jays need. If JP put BJ Ryan on the trade block, would he get a prospect back? Would that be worth it considering that hopefully Brandon League can pick up next year where he left off, and they’re getting Accardo (who had 30 saves a couple years ago) back as well? Do they NEED BJ? Or would it be better to trade him to free up some salary for Furcal and one of the free agent starting pitcher’s you’ve been talking about all season?
MW: I would take a flier on Furcal, but I wouldn’t sign him to a multi-year deal worth over $10 million a season. The Ryan question has been answered here dozens of times.
- Bradley BedfordI agree that Furcal isn’t worth the risk, but with an agent like Paul Kinzer would he sign for a single year deal?
Speaking of Kinzer, any ideas on who the Angels closer will be next year at this time?
MW: I don’t know what the agent has to do with it. Furcal will be offered a multi-year deal by more than one team, so why would he settle for a one-year contract? Angels closer next year? I’m thinking Jose Arredondo.
- Bradley BedfordDo you think JP will (not should) offer Furcal a multi-year deal? Or is that wishful thinking on my part?
MW: No, I don’t think he will.
- Bradley BedfordAny thoughts on the WBC? Bob Elliott had a column with their expected roster sometime during the summer but I can’t find it now. Canada has got to have a good chance to do some damage. Losing Bedard weakens the staff, but with Harden, Dempster, Francis, and (shawn) Hill starting. Jesse Crain and Scott Richmond in the ‘pen. Hopefully Gagne has finished his post-steroid slump and can be reliable.
Do you know if the tournament uses AL or NL rules ? (DH or no DH?)
Votto, Morneau, Thorman (can’t hit a curve-ball), Orr, Tehan, Stern, Bay, Martin, Lawrie…. Can’t think of anymore off the top of my head, but that’s a damn good start.
MW: Don’t forget Matty Stairs! They use a DH.
- Bradley BedfordI didn’t know if Matt would still play. He would be a bench player wouldn’t he? They’ve got Morneau at first base, Votto can DH or 1B and same with Thorman.
Would Adam Loewen make the team as an outfielder? Have you heard anything on how that change is going?
MW: I think Votto might play the outfield and Stairs DH. I’d rather have Matt in there than Thorman. I doubt Loewen will be able to play at the level required by March, but I’d love to see it.
- Bradley Bedfordaumont was unavailable for the Olympics, do you know if he’ll be good to go in march?
MW: He means Phillipe Aumont. The answer is probably, but the Mariners might not let him. Thanks to Shi Davidi of the Canadian Press.
- Bradley BedfordThanks,
If the Mariners let him pitch than the bull-pen gets a lot better. Any chance Evan Grills would play for the team?
MW: I doubt very much you’d see them take a high schooler to the tourney.
- Bradley BedfordEven a lefty is throws in the high 80s to low 90s, and has a 70-75 mph hammer?
What about Eliopoulos? He’s graduating this year.
MW: I wouldn’t bet on it.
- Bradley Bedford