11:20 PM Eastern
Ramon Hernandez homered off Jason Frasor in the 8th inning of tonight’s game, a no-doubt shot to dead centre at Camden Yards.
That home run gave the BALTIMORE FREAKIN’ ORIOLES six players with double-digit home run totals for the season. That’s six more than the Blue Jays. That is all.
Oh, here’s tonight’s edition of The JaysTalk – I don’t know if it was a full moon or what, but wow:
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Rational, reasonable comments are always welcome!
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Hey Mike… See ya next spring!
MW: Look forward to it.
- SpiderSilvaHi Mike, I was listening to Jays talk & I don’t understand how you can say that you don’t mind having John McDonald in the Jays lineup everyday…& I don’t understand how you can say he saves as many runs as Eckstein can produce; Runs saved by McDonald won’t = Eckstein’s RBI’s or anywhere close(or maybe I heard you wrong on that one).Yes, he is probably one of the best shortstops in the league defensively but he is just terrible offensively, which I know you agree. He has a slugging % of .207 & OBP of .242 batting .190. Yes, I know he has not given a good chance this year & has only played 36 games but throughout his whole career, he’s had similar numbers. Career, he has .312 slugging, .277 OBP & .238 average…So, as a team that is not good offensively, the Jays can’t afford to give him time & assume he can all of a sudden hit when he hasn’t his whole career. The Jays have to go by something. I know you really like the guy(I think too much) but to say you don’t mind him in the lineup everyday is not logical especially on a team that is not hitting very well the last year & a half…I can understand to give him a chance if there is a good sign he is capable of hitting .275, maybe .350 slugging %(double & triples) & .365 OBP but he has not shown any of that in any year of his career. My point is that if a team that wants to contend, can’t afford to have a regular hitter in the lineup hitting anywhere near the numbers he has now no matter how good he is defensively…Actually, I don’t think there is a regular position player on any good team in the league who has those kinds of offensive numbers as he does. Anyways, I do think you are doing a great job with this blog & it does looks tough too so keep up the good work Mike.
MW: You’re right, he’s not a good hitter – at all. But I have yet to be able to get my head around the whole runs saved vs. runs produced thing. To this point this season, Eckstein has 28 “runs created” against McDonald’s 3, in four times the plate appearances. So the question is, would McDonald have saved the Jays 16 more runs, or one every 4-5 games or so, than Eckstein? The answer, I think, is yes. And it’s also safe to assume that McDonald would be producing more offensively (though probably around .240/.280/.315) if he were getting more playing time. Still, though, I go back to the fact that the Jays have lost far more games this season because of their offense than because of their defense. So I guess, in the final analysis, I’d rather have Eckstein in the line-up every day at shortstop, but I’m fine with McDonald.
- Dominic N.Just watching the Mariners/Red Sox game and heard something that woke me up:
Seattle announcer: Francona says while he is concerned about New York, you talk to him and the team he says fears is Toronto. He says the Blue Jays are going to make a run.
Thinking this was all BS, I found it also on the internet:
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5haxkMYvUZ7i58vc1hR8fxlJCvywgD922JT8O0
Just thought I would throw this out there for people to chew on!
MW: Very nice of Francona. Not really true, though.
- Jim Bmike who is the worst first baseman in blue jays history?
MW: I’ll go with Charlie Beamon.
- roccoI have composed a list of top 10 things that p*** mike wilner off
1 – catch him in a contradition (which is very easy to do)
2 – call him a liar when he misquotes stats in his favor
3 – misquote him
4 – call aj a .500 pitcher
5 – criticize lyle overratedbay
6 – tell him that anton, terry, vito, and neil all have more baseball knowledge than him
7 – ask him if he is a believer in tbay yet
8 – tell him that obp is not the most important stat in baseball
9 – tell him that derek jeter is the greatest defensive shortstop
10 – call him JP’s lap dog
MW: I would say “be an idiot” is at the top of the list.
- chubbyMike,
As always, I want to thank you for your dedication to this blog — you really don’t have to do it with such thoroughness (your wife probably thinks you SHOULDN’T do it), and you’ve provided a wonderful outlet for venting. Okay, now I can tear into you!
Your “wow” response to Jays Talk can be explained very simply, and it’s not the full moon. What we’re witnessing is a kind of “Emperor Has No Clothes” situation in reverse. I don’t want to use too much hyperbole, but you seem to be the only one who doesn”t see it and that’s what the fans are frustrated by. You are right in the abstract about most things: management shouldn’t listen to fans, injuries ARE a problem, it couldn’t necessarily have been expected that some players would be underperforming, and Seattle and Cleveland ARE having worse years than the Jays. I have written to you before, and since you have the last word, you have tended to dismiss most of my arguments about J.P. (correctly or not). I could tell you that Alex Rios had a power break by the second half of last year, that Scott Rolen has lost it, that Lyle Overbay has always been an average first baseman, that injuries happen to every team, that J.P. has misjudged talent many times, that his drafting record is very average 7 years into his term, etc., etc. I am sure you could provide a logical, reasonable comeback to every one of these points. But the bottom line is that many people (and not just fans) empirically or intuitively have come to the same conclusion about J.P. that you have about Jesse Litsch: HE IS NOT THAT GOOD. He’s had 7 years, and the results — whatever the excuses, however legitimate they may be — haven’t changed. (They even seem to have regressed this year…) Maybe we’re all wrong and you are right — you do this professionally, and we are hacks. And sometimes, a critical mass is reached because of mob mentality. Yet every once in a while, a mob just might be right. Please give that possibility some serious consideration.
One last thing. Regardless of which of us is right about J.P., I’d be willing to bet a large amount of money that he will not have his job next year.
Alex
MW: And I certainly wouldn’t take that bet, I think the odds are against him returning though it continues to puzzle me as to why the can wouldn’t have been tied to him already if his bosses were sure he’s not coming back. You’re right, often there is a critical mass that develops because of a mob mentality, but that doesn’t mean the mob is right.
- AlexMike, on the show tonight, you said being old is not the reason why the team is not performing well and you mentioned the core group of players (32 and younger that are still young and I agree) but by that token, at those ages, can you reasonably expect any of them to get better or return to the level of 2006? It seems with each passing year, as injuries have become excuses, the players have become 1 year older and 1 year more removed from “returning” to their 2006 numbers…
MW: It shouldn’t seem that way, it IS that way. It is unassialable that with each passing year, players become 1 year older and 1 year farther removed from 2006. But it boggles the mind that so many people are unable to see the difference between “bad year” and “finished”.
- FrankMike, it kills me to see you say that a case can be made for Pujols over ARod. I don’t see the case for ARod! Let’s first look at their bats -
.333 .424 .619 Pujols
.306 .389 .578 ARod
Phat Al’s career line is basically what ARod did in 2007 (.314/.422/.645), his best season of his career. To me, their bats are incomparable, and I will go as far as to say that as of today, Albert Pujols is the greatest right handed hitter of all time.
Only looking at their offense is silly, because ARod plays a more important defensive position. But is the difference big enough to make up that huge gap in the hitting? And while ARod was once a gold glove SS, his frame has grown considerably since then, and nobody can know how he would have handled it as he aged. Pujols is a fantastic fielder himself at first, and he probably wasn’t that bad at third when he broke into MLB.
ARod is obviously the better runner, but Pujols isn’t slow.
To sum, Pujols is a far better hitter and plays premium defense, while ARod is a faster runner who plays a harder position at a lower level. Also, if you look at their OPS by month over their career, it seems that Pujols is the more consistent hitter, less prone to slumping than ARod. When you factor in the tremendous difference in character, this one is really easy for me.
Albert Pujols is far and away the best player in baseball.
MW: They’re both incredible hitters. The two things that popped most into my head when I was trying to decide between them were defense and longevity, and A-Rod has Phat Al (I like that) significantly in both, that’s why I picked him. By the time both their careers are finished, it may well be the reverse, and maybe easily.
- Ari“1 – Sorry to disappoint you, I’ll try to do better. 2 – It really doesn’t matter that you don’t care. I don’t think Scoot deserves the playing time, either, I was just explaining why it’s happening. 3 – Cito mentioned yesterday that he may bump Lind up all the way to the 2-hole.”
1. Disappointed? No, I was just surprised that somebody who has been around the game so often missed something that easy. Roy missed Zobrist after Cito came out (it obviously wasn’t just to check his stamina), so they just decided to wait until Navarro came up to send a message. The first pitch Dioner got was a 97 MPH fastball right at him. It was no mistake.
2. I was just venting, it didn’t have anything to do with what you believe. Of course it doesn’t matter if I don’t care, I’m not making the lineups. Even though I would seemingly do a better job of doing that than Cito.
3. It better happen soon in this lost cause of a season. They not only give their best hitter as many at bats as they can (which can help them win games now), but they also help his future as well.
- SteveHi Mike,
First off, I read your blog regularly but haven’t listened to ‘The JaysTalk’ this year (yes, even though it’s posted right in your blog)… until tonight. It didn’t seem like this show was the norm but it was still painful to listen to.
I was however, struck by the AJ/Halladay comparison and wanted to see the stats for myself. I had to calculate these myself but I think they check out.
Barometer:
WHIP, K/9, BB/9, HR/9
“By that barometer, A.J. Burnett’s career numbers going into this season were remarkably similar to Roy Halladay’s career numbers going into this season.”
Going into 2008:
Burnett:
WHIP 1.27
K/9 8.16
BB/9 3.76
HR/9 0.80
Record 69-66
ERA 3.76
IP 1155
CG 18
SHO 9
Halladay:
WHIP 1.23
K/9 6.23
BB/9 2.20
HR/9 0.76
Record 111-55
ERA 3.63
IP 1562
CG 31
SHO 9
I agree. The numbers support your comments and am quite impressed that you dropped that off the top of your head.
The tricky part comes when comparing intangibles. It’s my perception that Halladay has every single intangible (work ethic, determination, leadership etc..) required for a pitcher to be classified as the best in league as well as the numbers. Burnett seems to have the attitude of a sub-.500 pitcher and the skills of an all-star. I can never view him as even remotely close to Halladay because of this fact even after comparing key pitching stats. This can change (a lot of scrutiny was placed on Josh Beckett a few years ago for similar reasons) but I don’t think it will.
MW: Thanks for doing the research. I had done it this winter, so I didn’t exactly pull it off the top of my head. You’re right about the intangibles, but they’re intangible.
- ButtersMike
I completely respect your opinion re the jays. I don’t think anyone knows the team or the game much better than you.
I love the jays and live and die with them. I agree that at the start of the season i thought we had a good hitting team on paper. Do you keep the same guys and hope they get back to career average seasons. Can you tell me if you were in JP’s shoes what would you do right now and into next year. Where do we go?
MW: As I’ve said many times, I would have signed Barry Bonds back in April. What would I do in the off-season? See if I could make a deal for a shortstop, sign a legit DH, and try to upgrade first base.
- RobWhat is the deal with Dopriak? Do the Jays plan to promote him or is he just at Duneiden because he is the hometown boy?
MW: The fact that he’s in his 6th year of professional baseball and still in A-ball should serve as a mighty big red flag.
- Abdouni. RHi Mike : Listening to JaysTalk I really envy you your job as monitor(not!). Are these people rational responsible human beings? I can’t believe that they can’t understand reality. The team is NOT HITTING…for whatever reason. They are capable of hitting, but for some unknown reason they aren’t. It has nothing to do with how OLD they are. They should be more competitive, but they aren’t. This is NOT JP’S FAULT! Maybe they’re trying too hard, maybe they’re not seeing the ball because of this (or some other reason), but the team will go down this season as an enigma…talented non-performers. It’s been a frustrating year, and it will continue to be until they turn it around….if they do.
- JackWhat the hay…we might even win this series. Go Jays !!
Mike love the show . Must say tonight was one award winning edition . Will Shannon Stewart be on the roster when he comes back ? I mean I have been dissapointed with most hitters but I expectd a lot more from Shannon even befor he got injured he hit really bad and now with Lind here I dont see playing time for him .
MW: I think Stewart probably gets on the roster ahead of Mench, and maybe even Wilkerson.
- Grant SteinerHowdy, glad the All-Star thing is over. The mediocrity of the Jays and the lack of real baseball has me watching a lot of CFL.
I have something to run by the populace of Jaydom regarding the next ‘Wednesday With JP’. Everyone who calls in should lead with ‘J.P.,I think you should resign at the end of the year’… then give a single reason as to why.
Here’s mine: He refused to give Adam Lind, probably the best Jay bat since Cito came back, more than a cup of coffee with the big team, despite injuries AND the release of Thoms. It was obviously a Gaston move to bring him up. There was no way for J.P. to argue because he had about as much to do with Cito coming back as you did Mike.
You’ve said it before and you said it again last night. There is NO WAY the management or ownership of the Jays listens to the fanbase. I agree with that, and I’ve typed it before and I’ll type it again. We neither NEED nor DESIRE glossed over p.r. sessions with the GM when all of his focus should be on cracking 90 wins once a decade, or hiring a manager with a major league resume, or recruiting someone who might actually hit 20 homeruns in a season. Hey! Lets bring back Manny Lee, he had just the right amount of power to fit in nicely with the current squad.
I’ve got more, but I’ll save it. Nice to see apathy hasn’t got the better of me yet, even though we won’t be playing a meaningful game in August, let alone September.
MW: I don’t think you speak for the entire fanbase, though you certainly seem to believe that you do. There’s been far more positive response to having J.P. on every week than negative.
- Scott 'from North Bay'Face it Mike, this current edition of the Toronto Blue Jays is a collection of players who cannot hit. Rios, Wells, Overbay and Rolen are all having bad years. There is also too much in the way of everyday playing time for marginal role players like Scutaro, Inglett, Wilkerson and Barajas. If I’d told you that that group would get a significant amount of playing time at the start of the season, you could not have had a good feeling. Much was made of the fact Frank Thomas was about to turn 40 years old while it was conveniently ignored that Matt Stairs was in that same boat. Stairs was okay as a reserve who filled in a lot last year but giving him a two year contract and raising his bar of expectation did not bring out the best in him. If a majority of these guys are brought back next year, we can expect more of the same. When you think about it, it’s a wonder this team is not on its way to a 100 loss season. I do not expect Rolen or Overbay to get better, but I pray this is not what we get from Wells and Rios from here on. If so, then the Jays are going to be setting up shop in the neighborhood the Rays and Royals have occupied for the last decade. I hope last year was not Aaron Hill’s “career year”. He was terrible at the time of his injury as well.
Players can start to go downhill at or before age 30. Look at Jesse Barfield and Lloyd Moseby for proof.
MW: Moseby and Barfield both had their best years behind them at 28, which is the massive exception, not the rule. This is by no means a collection of players who cannot hit. That’s a ridiculous statement.
- Jim BranscomeMike,
I agree, W.h.i.p is a great measure of a pitcher. Burnett’s lifetime MLB whip is 1.29 over almost 1300 innings. Frankly I was surprised by this. After looking very close at his career numbers, I believe that Burnett is going to be the blue jay’s next Chris carpenter. Meaning, he will leave us and is going to have huge success in the next 5 years somewhere else. He looks to be a prime candidate to mature into a more consistent “winner”. People need to lay off the 50-50 crap because playing on a Florida marlin team for 7 years then moving here and being on a very inconsistent hitting jays team for for 3 more doesn’t help the WIN column. There is way too many factors dependent on wins to judge the pitcher for them…which is ironic to say the least, since baseball gives pitchers wins or loses.
The 50-50 thing is OLD, TIRESOME, AND JUST PLAIN NOT LOGICAL.
MW: He’s a little old to predict huge success in the next 5 years, but it could certainly happen, which is why he’s going to get a very nice contract in the off-season.
- MikeI don’t know if you already know this, but according to a database of mine, tomorrow will be the Blue Jays 5000th regular season game.
http://jayscountry.ca/total_record.php
It would be cool if you mentioned that before tomorrow nights game. I’d double check with the Blue Jays to verify first.
MW: According to baseball-reference.com, they’ve only played 4996.
- ErikHey Mike
Tough show last night. I must say, you do seem to be going to great lengths to defend JP. One of your early callers had a good point when he said there is a big chunk of the Jays payroll that isn’t even in the starting lineup (Close to 20 million between Thomas, Eckstein and Zaun…almost 1/5 of the payroll) You dismissed the caller by saying “we” don’t pay the players, Rogers does. True, but your being picky, i actually thought that guy made a valid point.
Also, you were once asked to point out a few of JP’s best deals, and you responded by referencing the Accardo deal. Now you say JP has had decent drafts and make reference to Accardo. Accardo wasn’t drafted, nor was Overbay, so lets not cloud the issue. Should we start giving the Mets props for drafting Johan Santana, or the Brewers credit for drafting Sabathia? If we do analyze other teams drafts in this manner, it gets worse for JP, not better.
The Jays minor system is filled with guys JP either drafted or signed, and it ranks as one of the weakest systems overall. It also has just 1 guy that is ranked in the top 100 (Snider). Although it appears he has made some better selections the last couple years, his first 5 years were poor at best.
We can debate the draft record and the free agents signings until we are blue in the face, but the one fact that can’t be debated is this….the team has not been in contention since JP took over 7 years ago, which in my humble opinion, is unacceptable.
Thanks again for the blog which allow me to vent….
- rickBack in 1977 i was a regular caller along with Mark (Mark went on to do big things with CBC-TV ,of course Hockey Night in Canada)I went on to be a school principal ,Oh by the way Early Wynn tabbed me 77…I just wanted to see you are one the best of the best for you call in show I have no interest in calling but i love to listen .What turns me on is you try to be fair and are not a yes man .Keep up the excellent work If there was an Emmy for radio personnel you would be right there..Maybe there is a reward i am not sure Good Luck Archie here
MW: Thank you! Who’s Mark?
- Archie FedrigoHey Mike,
It’s well documented that Litsch started the season 7 – 1 and has since gone 1 – 6… is it time he goes down to the minors to work on things?
(I imagine this had to be asked on JaysTalk, but I normally only listen to it when at work, later in the day)
Thanks
MW: I don’t think there’s a better option in the minors right now, and I don’t think that a tough time for a 5th starter on a team going nowhere means that a trip to the minors is necessary. If Litsch is going to be part of this team’s future, why not let him try to work it out?
- LukeHi Mike. Do you think it would help Jesse Litsch to spend a little time in AAA or is he better than the next best option (Parrish/Murphy)?
And why would Brian Wolfe get sent down and not Brandon League?
MW: I answered the first already, as for the second – I don’t know.
- ZackMike,
I think Cito is a smart enough guy to know that you dont blast a player in private and then come out and tell the media what you said and expect him to respect you. If you praise him that is what the media has to write about.
Can you fire two managers in one year or is there an unwritten rule?
MW: Cito should be fired for having a closed-door meeting with a player who is badly struggling at the plate?
- jwHi Mike,
I enjoy your show. Better when the Jays win, but, anyway.
I’m writing to find out why you are so against won-lost record as a measure of a pitcher’s worth. I agree that it may be overrated but I think it does mean something. Pitchers with a good record know how to win. You may then point out that the stats don’t bear this out, ie there are no clutch hitters. But take a look at the Angels for an extreme example of knowing how to win.
A pitcher without proper focus and great abilities may lose concentration when given a lead thinking they can let up and suddenly they give up some runs and get pulled.
Think of it this way. You will agree that pitchers that win 20 games are good pitchers. You will agree that pitchers who lose 20 games are bad pitchers. If you accept the extremes, then you must accept that there is also a scale in the middle.
Now Mike, of course there are good pitchers with .500 records. I certainly agree with you on that. But won-lost record means something, it does show some pitchers are good indeed, or bad indeed. Take a look at Pat Hentgen for example, who managed to win 20 games on a truly awful Jays team.
Anyway, don’t be so down on people who look at this stat. After all, it does come down to wins and Roy Halladay has done it throughout his career and AJ Burnett has not.
You have been pointing out at career stats as a good indicator for the hitters (how could people expect such seasons from Overbay? Rios? They are not in line with career stats!), why not the pitchers?
Thanks Mike! Keep up the good work.
MW: I do point out career stats for the pitchers, but won-lost record isn’t an important one. Pitchers with a good record don’t necessarily “know how to win”, unless they know how to get their team to score runs for them. I won’t say that a 20-game winner is always a good pitcher, and I definitely won’t say that a 20-game loser is a bad pitcher. You have to be pretty good to keep getting run out there long enough to lose 20.
- RoryMike, when is the management going to realize that Frazor doesn’t have it and hasn’t for a long time? The most frustrating thing about this bullpen is that people talk of their league leading numbers but to me it seems everytime they’re called upon in a critical situation all they do is blow up. And Mike when are they going to wake up and smell the coffee with League? League looks like something out of a Bruce Lee movie. Again, all I ever see him do is blow up. I must be missing something because I don’t know where the bullpen are putting up these impressive numbers everybody talks about. Of course it’s always the hitters’ fault and never the pitching, although it seems our pitching always seems to blink first in a stare down. They need to get better in the pen and not just with the offense.
MW: It’d be tough to be much better in the bullpen. Blame the relievers all you want, but often they’re put in a position where they have to pitch 4-7 shutout innings in order for the Jays to score a run.
- Vito From HamiltonSo let’s see…. Rios, Lyle doubleplay, Wells, Rolen locked up for how many more years? Wow!
- Danny from MapleThanks for the memories J.P.
Bad trades, bad drafting, bad contracts, lying to fans the list goes on.
So long J.P. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
Hi Mike,
With these Blue Jay lossess mounting do you think it is time to retool starting from management down to the players on the field? It appears whatever plans were set forth for this season are not workng.
MW: It does appear that way, but I don’t think there’s a need to retool everything. The Jays have one of the best pitching staffs in the game, and should have enough hitting, but the hitting isn’t hitting.
- MarkAt what point do the Jays give Purcey a prolonged look at the Major League level?
Do you think Brett Cecil gets a September call up, or is this a season too early?
MW: Soon, I think, and Cecil might get called up, but wouldn’t pitch more than two or three innings.
- RyanI listen to this show almost nightly, but tonight was just crazy. Entertaining, but crazy.
However I think everyone has it wrong. Mike is right, JP should not be fired, and Gibby should not have been fired. Nope, it should have been Paul Godfrey.
Mike, Callers, everyone else, listen, the only GD stat that counts towards ANYTHING, is win vs loss. That is it and that is all, batters, pitchers, etc, could care less, usually they all equal out to mean something. But under JP, this team is a 500 team at BEST. We are 7 years in under his plan, and we have made no progress in the Win vs Loss column. We are a 3rd place team on average, 2nd place as a 1 year high, and this year looking like a last place low.
After 7 years of the same mediocrity, the time has come that Mr. Godfrey should get the axe for simply not acting sooner. When he looks at the players lost due to confrontation, ego bursts, whatever, then we look at JP and his mouth flapping a little much from time to time and bringing unwanted negative press to our team, then we look at moves like throwing 8 million at a player to swing the bat for another team, signing Johnny Mac to a multi million dollar contract (I don’t care how little millions it is Mike, it is still Millions) then turn around a sign another play to play his position for even more money, then even not letting Lind come up and work with a major league bat and see what he can do, until he was forced to (Who has 2 less homers than the multi millionaire Rios), and on and on, all this adds up to an epic failure, and one that is 100% Paul Godfreys failure for not making a Gm move sooner.
Now we have to wait until next year, which in turn means even more waiting for a winner, as I am sure there will be a strong rebuilding in Jays land.
Please Mr. Rogers, stop raising my cable and internet bills, turn your attention to Baseball, and Donald Trump your head office.
MW: They already hit the last-place low a few years ago, and yeah, half a game back of 4th sure looks like last place again this year. What players were lost due to confrontation? Shea Hillenbrand? The guy who is currently out of baseball and who Ricciardi was able to trade for a pitcher who got them 30 saves last season for the ML minimum? Ted Lilly? I’m pretty sure he didn’t leave because of John Gibbons. And it’s great that you don’t care how many millions McDonald is making, “it’s still millions”, but he’s earning LESS than the major-league average salary.
- EricOn yesterday’s blog you mentioned free agent comp. Does every team get compensated if a player they had under contract during the previous year leaves via free agency?
Something I thought of on the way into work this morning. JP drafted Russ Adams, then Aaron Hill thinking one of them will take the SS job and fill it for a long time. Assuming that Hill recovers fully for next season, do you see Joe Inglett being the everyday 2B and Hill being moved back to SS? Has there been any rumblings to this end?
Would you want your leadoff guy to hit between 10 – 15 HR, get a bunch of doubles and be able to turn singles into doubles via the stolen base? This would make Rios the perfect leadoff guy except for his relatively poor OBP (.336 is a bit low for a leadoff guy). Thoughts?
MW: The low obp makes Rios far less than a perfect lead-off guy. I haven’t heard any rumblings about moving Hill back to short from anyone who matters, but if Inglett keeps this up it might be the thing to do. Not every team gets compensated for a player who leaves via free agency, the player has to be good enough.
- Aaron KerMike
Do you ever consider ‘foolish statements’ that you made earlier in the season and regret them. I.E. the Orioles will lose over a 100 games this year? It seems pretty obvious that these two teams will battle it out for fourth place. I think that it is safe to say that neither of these teams will lose 100 games.
With each passing day Tampa Bay appears to be the ‘real deal’. They might get passed by the Red Sox and Yankees but they have the look of a contending team for many years. The Blue Jays have three teams to look up at now. It could be many more years before they are in a position to be a contender. A total restructuring may be necessary. I realize that you see it as the ‘glass being half full’, but most realistic fans see this team as having very good pitching, very weak hitting, no power, average fielding, and too many players who are overpaid and have long term contracts. In other words very little flexibility. Would a new GM be able to clean up this mess, within 2 years? What do you think?
MW: Do you mean that the fact that I’m unable to clearly see the future means I make “foolish statements”?
- BrianI don’t really remember a team going into August without a 10HR guy. Do you? It might be the case with Jays this year. Rios, Wells, Stairs, Rolen and maybe Overbay should have easily passed 10 by now. How can 5 guys implode at the same time? and none has been mentioned in the Mitchell report. Mystery!
MW: Wells will have missed two months when August 1st hits, so I don’t think you can blame him. But it is nuts.
- Beburg aka The relief pitcherMike –
I’ve been paying attention to our minor leaguers a bit more recently. It’s been a good couple of days for the guys on the farm.
Brian Dopirak continues to rake at Dunedin. He’s hitting .298/.374/.559 with 20 2Bs, and 23 HRs. 90 Strikeouts in 349 ABs though with 41 BB. That seems ok. Why isn’t he on the radar? We keep hearing the other names like Snider, Arencebia, Cooper and Campbell. I think Dopirak is only 23!
Speaking of the other guys – they’re all doing well and have hit HRs in the past 2 days. Last night – Scott Campbell (3-for-4, 2 2B, 2 BB, 3 R) and Snider (1-for-2, HR, 4 BB, 3 R, 2 RBI). And this is a night after Campbell and Arencebia hit 2 HRs each. Dopirak hit 2 last night. Cooper looks like he’s raking at Auburn and now at Lansing. Justin Jackson hit a 3 run HR last night. Purcey won last night too!
All this means little for this installment of the Jays though. Anyway, what can you tell us about Dopirak?
MW: See above.
- TMike,
What is the Jay’s pitching staff looking like for next year? We all figure Burnett is gone, so who do you see replacing him? Also, if McGowan is done for the rest of this year, when do you see him coming back? To me the staff looks like it may have a hole or two next year:
1. Halladay
2. Marcum
3.
4.
5. Litsch
If McGowan is ok to go next year, then we only have one spot to fill, but the chance of both him and Marcum being 100% next year is low so we’ll probably have two spots to fill.
MW: Why would the chance of Marcum being 100% be low? If McGowan needs surgery, he may miss all of next year, in which case you can put Purcey and “Free Agent X” in those two spots. Maybe Casey Janssen, but probably not until later in next season.
- PatrickI also enjoyed the brevity of today’s blog. Very fitting.
- RoryRight now the Baltimore FREAKIN Orioles are better than the Toronto FREAKIN bluejays….at least in the standings. To bad on paper did not mean something this year.
MW: Indeed
- KDMike,
I totally agree with your assessment of Litch… a good #5 starter. Guys in my fantasy league were trying to push him early on claiming otherwise.
A comment of one of your callers tonight. Saying that Burnett is a .500 pithcer and leaving it at that is absolute crazyness. There is more than the pitchers performance that results in a win…ie. fielding and hitting. For some prime examples check out some of Doc’s games this year that he would have one granting that the Jays would have actually drove in some runs.
A technical question for you Mike. I was watching the game on TV tonight and the announcers were saying the Orioles could not send a pitcher back down to the minors because he was out of options. Could you explain to me what this means?
MW: A player only has three option years once he’s placed on the 40-man roster, and once those option years are used up a player has to clear waivers in order to be sent to the minors.
- IanIn last night’s Jays Talk, you once again defended JP’s record as a GM, just as you have consistently said you feel the current team is better than its recoird indicates. I’ve got an observation and a question for you . . .
First, the observation: The Jays’ record in their 6.5 seasons under JP is a cumulative 529-541, with no playoff appearances.
Now, the question: If as a broadcaster your show or your station was consistently 3rd, 4th (or even fifth –in 2004 and again so far this season)in the ratings for its time slot, how long before you’d be doing something else? Or would your boss say, “It’s OK, Mike. You’ve had a cold” or “Those guys over at the other stations have m0ore money to spend on on-air talent”?
Pro sport is entertainment, and it’s abou results. I’m no JP basher, but the Jays’ record is what it is. Medicore, at best. So I’ve come to the conclusion JP has gone about as far as he can in Toronto. The hiring of Cito as manager and Mel Queen to assess the state of the farm system suggests the guys who sign the cheques at Rogers are starting to feel that way too.
Where am I wrong in my assessment of the situation?
MW: This should be in the FAQ. In the first three years of J.P.’s tenure, he was under direction to pare the payroll by almost 50%. In the 4th year, he was given a payroll boost, but not until February by which time Carlos Delgado and Kelvim Escobar had already left. In the 5th year, they weren’t good enough, in the 6th, they were besieged by injury and now, in the 7th, they’ve disappointed. Mel Queen wasn’t hire to “assess the state of the farm system”, he was hired to work with the minor-league pitchers.
- Ken from KingstonThis looks like a very frustrated post. Don’t forget, you don’t need to hit home runs, they just need everyone to hit.
MW: Home runs help quite a bit.
- Peter B.Well, after watching that game last night I don’t have too much to say other than with our fifth starter on the mound, losing the opener shouldn’t be too much of a surprise. Let’s wait to see what the Jays do in the next three games before we all pass judgement on this series.
On a final note, even though this season appears not to be a successful one, fans should still tune in to games just to watch Scott Rolen play third base.
- DerekHi Mike,
I have two questions for you:
First, as frustrating as it has been to be a fan of this team this year, I wondered whether it’s more frustrating for you to have to cover them as a job since you don’t have the option of turning the games off?
Second, do you know if Matt Stairs is still getting hitting advice from Gary Denbo? The reason I ask is that as I recall, Matt was very vocal about his thoughts on Gary when he was fired and seemed to blame a lot of the team’s (and presumably his) hitting woes on Gary. I guess I just figured that Matt would be back to his 2007 self if Gary was the problem but he still stinks so I just wondered if Gary had snuck back into the clubhouse and was working with Matt again?
Sorry but for someone like Matt who’s been around for as long as he has been, I was pretty disappointed with his comments at the time. Matt gets paid a lot of money (definitely more than Gary Denbo did) to hit a ball with a piece of wood. The hitting coach is a resource that players can use or lose but to throw a guy under the bus (and then run over him a few times) when you’re not getting YOUR job done seemed really classless to me.
Thanks again for all of your hard work on the show and the blog Mike. You’re the voice I turn to when I want to make sense out of this crazy mixed up world.
MW: Thanks, Heather – your second point is a very good one. As to the first, no, I’m not frustrated by the Jays performance so much as I’m frustrated by the callers and commenters who want to use me as their personal punching bag.
- HeatherHi Mike,
Long-time listener/reader, first-time writer.
First – my compliments, Mike, I disagree with your opinions almost as much as I agree with them – but there’s no doubt you add a lot to the radio broadcast. I often enjoy the post-game show more than the game, itself. Keep up the great work!
My question is this: of all the things you argue with callers about – I find your support of this general manager’s draft record most perplexing. In seven years, JP Ricciardi’s drafts have produced (or been responsible for the acquisition of):
Aaron Hill – a promising, 26 year-old second baseman who is great defensively. It looks he’ll be above average at the plate – but likely not anything special. Still, though, a good pick.
Shawn Marcum – a great pick, and a guy who could be a potential front of the rotation starter (probably a number two guy?).
Lyle Overbay – a guy who had a couple really good years before he broke his hand. But he’s a double play machine – and I think it’s tough to argue that he’s among the top ten first basemen in the American League. OBP aside, he’s killing this team.
Adam Lind – it’s way too early to tell how good he’ll be, but looks promising so far.
So, here’s the thing: I’m not a JP hater. I agreed with many of the Major League-level moves he made at the time he made them, and it’s unfair to use hindsight as a bias.
But I understood JP to be a great talent evaluator, who would build this team through the draft. I’m more bullish on the most recent drafts (Cecil, Snider, Jackson, Arencibia, etc.), but it’s tough to argue that the above returns are all that impressive for seven years of drafting.
Your thoughts?
MW: J.P. actually didn’t draft Overbay (who is by no means “killing this team”), but he did trade three players for him, two of whom he did draft. He also drafted Casey Janssen, and traded players he drafted for Jeremy Accardo, Brian Tallet, John McDonald and Marco Scutaro. If you look at the first seven years of a lot of GM’s, that’s pretty good return.
- MikeIt is going to be an interesting off-season! I’m being very zen about this version of the Jays. They’ll finish last or they won’t. No point worrying, I’ve gone beyond that!
The rumours are that Godfrey will be replaced as well as Ricciardi. I think those rumours have an excellent chance of coming true, and that will happen very shortly after the end of the season. What happens next? This team has basically been together for a while, and it hasn’t worked out. I expect one of Rios/Wells to go as well as Overbay (if you’re right about his trading potential!). Burnett may or may not go. If Ricciardi is right, and no one came looking for him, he might stay where he is getting quite a lot of money instead of opting out and not getting as much. I don’t think he’s a lock to leave at the end of the year.
I wonder if Cito will be back. He may feel that he’s rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic right now. And I’m not sure he has much regard for the front-office. I am guessing that a lot of changes would have to be made to bring him back in ’09.
MW: I don’t think Cito is in much position to dictate changes in order to have him stay. No one was banging down his door to give him a major-league job before the Jays gave him this opportunity. I don’t expect either of Rios or Wells to go, new regime or otherwise. Rios has a terrific contract, and Wells is at the low point of his value.
- reyesHi Mike,
I’m a big jays fan. I’m horribly depressed as one. What do you think this team has to do to actually win games. Also, do you think the team should move Jesse Litsch to the fifth starter to take a little bit of pressure off of him. Because the all star game passed do you mind giving me the pitching rotation that would be very helpful. Thanks for answering.
MW: Jesse Litsch is the fifth starter, he just got the fourth game after the break because they wanted to give Marcum another day. In order to win games, I think they have to hit enough to support their pitching, but I’ve thought that all season long. The five starters coming out of the break, in order, were Burnett, Halladay, Parrish, Litsch and Marcum.
- MikeyMike, at the beginning of the season (during spring training), Bob Mccowan openly stated he thought the team was mediocre, and going no where this year. He felt that we just didn’t have enough talent to win. I don’t know if you consider him someone who “knows anything about baseball” but he did say this. Could also be his general pessimism but he does know what he’s talking about for the most part.
I know the whole team is slumping but I’m gonna list a few gaping holes we will need to fill in the offseason and I’d like your comment.
DH – A combination of 160 lb David Eckstein and 40 year old Matt Stairs just does not cut it, if we need power the DH should be the #1 person it comes from.
Shortstop – One of the most important positions on the team, and JP currently has 3 of them, none of which can perform adequately. I would be happy with a guy that can hit for decent average and has some speed on the base pathes.
1B/3B – I don’t mind Rolen or Overbay but we NEED power out of one of these positions. I would take Rolen just for his defensive skill if we had 30 HR’s coming from our first baseman.
Thats it for position players, I would be fine with Barajas playing the season at Catcher and bring up someone young to back him up.
Out of all those needs I listed it would be nice if one of them was a left handed bat that could actally hit, this need isn’t as drastic now that Lind seems to be doing fine.
MW: I write it off to McCown’s general pessimism. As for shortstop, is Eckstein not exactly what you described?
- Pauli like how when u lose an argument you just say “oh there is no point answering that question” LOL
MW: When does that happen?
- danny othometnaHey Mike,
Looking towards next and future years I was giving a concept though today: Should the Jays organization hold on to our core roster (as suggested they will by lame duck GM JP) in hopes that they will ‘rebound’ to their expected or good level of play, or should they acknowledge that having players with the capability of being so terrible (as they are this year) is not worth the risk, and thus they should look to move as many of the core players as possible (save for the pitchers). In other words, look to move Overbay, Rios, Rolen, Wells, etc. A near impossible task, but shouldn’t that be the game plan moving forward, rather than gambling that they can all be better?
MW: No, that shouldn’t be the game plan at all. None of the players you mention are having “terrible” years in a vacuum.
- MichaelThere’s no full moon this morning, Mike, and I’m throwing in the towel for the season. You would think that a team with wild card aspirations would come out of the second half chute with more, but the Jays haven’t been up to the task. Roy Halladay’s leadership comments haven’t inspired them. I am less than impressed with Rios’ abilities in that regard. Barajas is supposed to be one of the best of their hitters but his power numbers are still dismal.
I’m turning my attention to the Cubs with their 2.5 Canadians and 99 year drought, and the Twins, who manage to do what the Jays can’t do in the same financial circumstances.
MW: Barajas is supposed to be one of the Jays’ best hitters? Rios is supposed to be a leader?
- GerryMike,
How about throwing BJ Ryan in the trade bait? He is probably one of the most underused players in baseball this year. Either the Jays are are not winning or when they are, the starters are so good they barely need a closer.
In the past month how many real save situations did he pitch in? If he’s on the team and healthy let him just pitch every other day or so even if its for the 7th or 8th inning!
MW: Why?
- Shmuel Yitzchok“”"He looks to be a prime candidate to mature into a more consistent “winner”.”"”
this comment by myself was not intended to sound as it does. What I meant was his numbers are very good, if he left and went to a decent defensive team with powerful bats the wins will come over the next few years, hence he would be a good candidate to have more wins and the people that only look at wins will see him as a more legit or “consistant” pitcher.
- MikeHi Mike, going to be in WIndsor for the week, so are there any stations in that area on which I can listen to the Jays still? WIndsor Ontario that is.
MW: Try 1070 AM in Sarnia or 980 AM in London.
- DanMike,
After 100 games can we now move forward from saying that this team is a bunch of guys having off years to saying that this offense is an embarassment. Nobody close to 50 RBI’s, 9 homeruns leading the team. It has reached the point where the only person coming to bat I look forward to is Adam Lind.
I’m not sure where the improvement will come from next year. I see no possible change in the outfield with Wells’ and Rios’s contracts not likely movable. Scott Rolen is probably in that category too. Assuming Aaron Hill comes back healthy, the only 2 upgradeable positions offensively appears to be 1st and short. I’m not aware of anyone close to being ready in the farm system to play those positions regularly.
Trading pitching is also difficult with McGowan hurt, Litsch coming back to earth and A.J. having an opt out.
I think the future of this team is looking pretty bleak and is beginning to look Raptor like, pre-Colangelo. It’s going to take an agressive GM with vision to turn this around. After 7 mediocre years, its safe to say JP is not the guy. It’s time Mr. Rogers and Mr. Godfrey woke up and looked for the new GM.
MW: That’s frustration talking. None of it is true.
- MarvinMike, who do you think the top 10 Jays prospects are at the moment? Here’s my list (in order of players I would choose from the organization if I were a competing GM):
Travis Snider
Brett Cecil
David Cooper
JP Arencibia
Justin Jackson
Scott Campbell
Kevin Ahrens
Marc Rzepcynski
Brad Mills
Brian Jeroloman
Just missing the cut, IMO: Purcey, Tolisano
I think the team needs some more minor-league depth, especially in the high minors, but this mid-season list looks stronger than many people expected.
MW: I couldn’t begin to put together a top-10 prospect list, there are only two guys on that list I’ve actually seen play baseball.
- GeoffMichaelus Wilnerus (that’s your name in Latin, I think):
I have some bones to pick with you. You’ve gone on about how you think the team is ‘close’ the way it is, and that the hitters have underperformed. But you know what? I don’t think either of those are true. They’re close all right…close to last place. I think the only hitters you can really say have underperformed are Rios and possibly Hill, while he was here. Look at the rest of what you have:
Zaun: as expected.
Barajas: actually better than expected.
Overbay: looks like 2006 was a career year, and is now on the wrong side of 30. Remember he was an old rookie, and players of his pedigree often don’t age well. He’s only 31 but might already be getting past it.
Hill: basically a lost season, but isn’t an elite hitter for a 2B anyway.
Eckstein: as expected. 33 years old and past prime.
Scutaro: as expected. Just a utility infielder type.
Rolen: probably as expected, given age and shoulder issues. Can still hit a bit, no power anymore, awesome fielder yet. But an basically an “old” 32. Past prime.
Lind: still fairly young, could be fairly good LF.
Wells: only 29, but that’s already past a hitter’s typical prime age 27/28 seasons. You imply he’s had a disappointing year, but besides missing time with injuries, is hitting 287/329/449. This is pretty much in line with what I expected. This is basically the kind of hitter he is. He’s only had two really good years.
Rios: power is gone, probably due to batting mechanics issues. Should be coming into prime now.
Stairs: as expected. He’s 40 and probably near the end of the line.
Wilkerson: done.
Stewart: also done.
You mentioned in Jays talk how the team isn’t that old, and it’s true that Stairs is the only hitter over 35, but it’s also true that in this post-steroid era that players have returned to a more normal aging pattern. It’s not that unusual for non-HOF calibre players to fall off a cliff around ages 32-34. The core of this team is getting into that range. I bet you it’ll be more of the same (or worse) from Zaun, Barajas, Rolen, Overbay, Wells, Eckstein next year.
MW: Zaun and Eckstein won’t be a consideration next year, and I would be very surprised if Wells and Overbay didn’t have much better years (Wells not necessarily with the rate stats, though his slugging should improve). I disagree with you about Hill, Overbay, Wells and Rios, and I wouldn’t go so far as to say that Rolen’s power is “gone”.
- Flaming MoeHi Mike,
I know A.J.Burnett being described as a 500 pitcher riles you but your saying he’s almost as good a pitcher as Halladay is straying perilously close to the border of stathead lunacy.
He’s a great thrower with great stuff but he’s no more than a good pitcher because he’s never been able to develop the consistent control and command,and more subjectively the composure, that very good and great pitchers do.
He’ll be 32 in January and the chances for him doing so are dwindling.I hope he pitches well in his next two starts before the non waiver trading deadline to enhance his value and for the rest of the year if he isn’t traded to maximize the draft choice compensation possible if arbitration is offered.
Like you I see no prospect of him being here next year unless he gets injured.If he doesn’t get hurt I can’t imagine how he could pitch badly enough to decide not to opt out.
Given the downside risk of injury and the resulting 12 million dollar salary albatross for the next 2 years I think that if JP can get something reasonably close to the equivalent of the possible draft choice compensation he should go in the next 10 days.
MW: I think that he will.
- MattHey Mike,
- tom stewartWho do think the Jays will deal before the deadline? I would think Eck, Stairs, Zaun and of course AJ?
Regarding the game, please I get sick watching this team.
I would like see Purcey called up and Litsch sent down to Triple A just for starts. Thanks Mike
Hi Mike.
I realize this is old news, but I haven’t had a chance to post my thoughts on the JP Ricciardi / Adam Dunn incident, and I think it is topical in the sense that it relates to the notion that, whatever else you say about the man, JP is “brutally honest and upfront”.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that, in the aftermath of the incident, JP only ‘apologized’ in the sense that he indicated he shouldn’t have said what he did because sometimes he’s too honest and it offends people…I don’t think JP admitted that the whole premise of his argument was wrong and that Dunn WOULD in fact be a valuable player that could help a team like the Blue Jays win (I ask that you please bear with me as this may take a bit of time to flesh out…).
From what I understand, when asked about the possibility of acquiring Dunn, JP said “He’s a lifetime .230, .240 hitter that strikes out a ton and hits home runs”. I feel this statement is, at best, misleading, because it doesn’t tell the whole story of Dunn’s productivity. As has been discussed, Dunn not only hits home runs, but in each of the past four years he’s hit a lot of them (averaged over 40), drove in a lot of runs (over 100 each year), drew over 100 walks per year, and has an on-base percentage that would make a lead-off hitter proud (usually in the .380s….not to mention the fact that Dunn seems to be on pace to put up similar numbers again this year. Would it not be fair to say that if the JP Ricciardi of 2008 was to show the JP Ricciardi of 2001-2004 twenty-eight year-old Adam Dunn’s stats and the stats of Overbay, Rolen, and the musical chair assortment of left fielders he’s had this year, the JP of 2001 – 2004 would absolutely say that Dunn is the type of hitter that he and other teams covet and can play a big role in helping a team win? In fact, weren’t guys with offensive stats like Dunn’s the kind of ‘dream’ player JP said he would love to have in his early years as Jays’ GM (guys who get on base and put the ball in the seats)…? Has JP now changed his mind re. the value of this type of player…?
Apparently, after the caller pointed out that hitting home runs is something the Blue Jays desperately need, JP replied that Dunn “…doesn’t really like baseball that much”, “…doesn’t have a passion to play the game that much”, and that the caller probably wouldn’t be very happy if Adam Dunn was brought in. I find these statements surprising on a number of counts:
1) If JP is arguing that his policy is to only bring in good character guys, it doesn’t seem to square with JP’s past moves of paying significant sums of money to go out and get players like Shea Hillenbrand and AJ Burnett (and I think even Frank Thomas) whom I believe all had reputations as being less than ideal ‘good attitude’ guys with their previous teams prior to becoming Blue Jays.
2) If JP is arguing that the problem is specifically with Dunn’s lack of enthusiasm for the game itself, Dunn has played quite lot of baseball over the past number of years and played it quite well for a guy who allegedly doesn’t really like or have a passion for the game (one has to wonder how much better he’d be if he actually DID like playing the game …the second coming of Babe Ruth anyone?). Would Dunn’s alleged ‘lack of love’ for the game be any more detrimental to a team’s chemistry or to winning games than the baggage that other star players with less than ideal attitudes bring to their clubhouses…? Would teammates even care how much he ‘loves’ the game if he can put up the kinds of numbers he does to drive in runs and help the team win…? Would fans boo as he rounds the bases after a 3-run home run because he doesn’t look too happy to be there?
3) Not ‘liking’ the game is, in any event, a very subjective accusation. I remember a number of people use to accuse a certain hockey player of not liking hockey very much, lacking passion for the game, and not giving it his best effort out on the ice. Nonetheless, that player went on to have a pretty good career and played a big role in helping his team win championships. His name? Mario Lemieux. Now I’m not arguing that Dunn is the Mario Lemieux of baseball, I’m just pointing out that rejecting the notion of bringing in an obviously talented and productive player because they apparently don’t love playing the game enough is likely at odds with what most successful GM’s do when assessing the merits of acquiring talent.
As an aside, there have been other instances where JP has made statements that seemed to fall far short of what one would consider truly honest. Of course the most infamous one took place during the BJ Ryan injury drama where JP apparently said “They’re not lies if we know the truth”. If JP was in fact quoted accurately here, this has got to be one of the strangest statements I have ever heard uttered by a professional in any field. From where I sit, the very textbook definition of a “lie” occurs when you know the truth yet proceed to make a false statement anyway. I can’t understand how anyone could view this any other way.
MW: Glad you could get that off your chest, but I did way too much commenting about this a month ago.
- JamesThe Jays are so perfectly mediocre it warms and breaks the fans’ heart at the same time.
Eric Hinske called and said playing in Canada sucks.
- Derek from Cloud9 SportsMike,
Do you know what Shannon Stewart’s status is? It seems like he’s been forgotten in this mess known as the 08 Blue Jays.
MW: Asked and answered, pretty much every day.
- BernardLOL! Full moon indeed.
My favourite part of your show is listening to you argue and correct the callers. Keep it coming!
Too old? LOL
- AndrewMike, it wasn’t a full moon… Neil didn’t call.
- ChrisIt doesn’t take a wiz to figure out what’s wrong with Jesse Litsch. Jesse does not have overpowering stuff therefore he has to do two things well. 1) he must have good location 2) he must change speeds more often.
If you watched last nights game more often than not everything was the same speed and in bad locations. Occasionly he changed speed and got guys out on their front foot but not often enough. To be honest I am surprised he didn’t give up more. Based on what I saw most of the Orioles were scrambling to see who could get to the bat rack faster. Bad news if he doesn’t change something and fast.
- mike glattnot sure if you have commented on this before…
I would love to hear your assessment of Hill’s ability to convert to SS. I know the jays have tried him there but i don’t remember it being a long look. second base is an easier position to fill, especially offensively. Short stop seems like either offense or defense. The one comment i remember is that Hill’s range at short was suspect.
Thanks.
MW: If you’re not sure if I’ve commented on something before, read back. This one, I definitely have, recently, several times.
- jeremyInglett
Scutaro
Rios
Overbay
Barajas
Stairs
Rolen
Lind
Eckstein
This is the line up a hundred Million Dollars gets you. I sure hope J.P. is gone at the end of the year.
MW: Actually, that’s the line-up that $28.7 million gets you.
- AnothonyJust heard your thoughts on Litsch… it’s all good, no need to make you answer the same questions over and over…
…
How are ya? (sorry I couldn’t resist!)
- LukeWhy does everyone say that JP should be fired because his team is underachieving? If the team is underachieving (which it obviously is) doesn’t that imply that JP put a good team together and the players should be playing better? JP did his job in my eyes.
MW: That’s a very different point of view than we usually see here. I think people want J.P. fired because they believe he should have known this team would underachieve.
- MattI’m fed up with this mediocrity.
- Steve from NJI think Gibbons is owed an apology; it’s obvious this teams failure had nothing to do with the manager.
It’s time for J.P. to go. Even though at the begining of this year I also liked the players we had (Overbay, Rolen, Eckstien,and Zaun), I’m not paid to be correct in my evaluations, J.P. is. It’s time to move on.
Say Goodbye J.P. “Goodnbye J.P.”
I have a recommendation for you – you need to keep the Dennis Green (they’re) “WHO WE THOUGHT THEY WERE” clip handy for every time a caller wants to take dumps on Stairs, Rolen, Ecsktein, Burnett, and Litsch. It just seems that for each one of these guys callers were expecting a lot better than they actually are at this point in their various careers.
MW: I don’t think it’s unreasonable to have thought that Rolen and Burnett would be having better years.
- AriHey Mike
It was a full moon last night and I admire your patience. I think we, as Jay fans, just get so frustrated with the team. It is like watching your kid, you know he is smart, but why isn’t performing at his potential at school and you go Arrrrrrrggghhh!!!!
Regarding JP (oh, no, not again). I don’t think he is a terrible manager but when you are in the eastern conference, when you have to compete with the Yankees and Boston, where they can burry a mistake by just signing another free agent, you need a genius GM, and I don’t think JP is one.
MW: Eastern conference?
- francisWell, I’ve been listening to your show for a month or so now, Mike (ever since the interest in Gibbon’s possible removal was heating up) and the amount of worthwhile debate/discussion from callers is just so far between. I commend your patience, not to take anything away from this being your job. I certainly appreciate what you seem to be able to squeeze out of them if only to keep people honest (read: remove ignorance).
As I’ve learned with following professional sports in any capacity, the results of a given team can only affect you as much as you let it. The more investment you put into watching a team, the more you have to care. That doesn’t absolve people from immunity from idiocy just because one has chosen to care. Let’s not forget this is about being entertained for the most part. Yes, winning helps, but as a fan “you” have chosen to care regardless. Perhaps that’s all I expect from people is a little responsibility.
I remember becoming interested in following the Blue Jays as Canada’s team after the 2002-2003 seasons. I was very disappointed when I learned how little Toronto supported this team as time went on as I was thoroughly pleased with how exciting the team was even without much success to their name. Then Delgado left, a lot of players have changed, we’ve found some impressive pitching, and the worse this team performs, the more worthwhile it would be if they ever do something again in meaninful autumn games.
Until then, I’ll choose to care, if only enough to distract myself during the summer.
- JasonHi Mike,
How’s it going? I hope it;s going better for you than it has for those Jays. This team is like a bad roller coaster. They go onto the roller coaster with high hopes. They slowly climb hills and show signs of greatness, then they go crashing back down. They hit a few speed bumps of up and downs and they end the ride unhappy the way it all turned out. I think Godfrey isn’t going to end up firing JP and to be honest, he really shouldn’t because JP brought a team here that has all the talent in the world and he isn’t a psychic and this team really has the potential to win 95 games. Thanks Mike
- WarrenHey Mike,
Gotta say the callers were colourful tonight to say the least. Many of them, although harsh had some pretty good points. Some get irrational when they get too emotional but I notice you do the same thing, so it is kinda neat to listen to.
A few things you said that I thought were a little irrational.
You try to defend this “JP could not see such a dropoff thing a lot,” (wish I could use that excuse in the business world) however when you say Stairs and Zaun are where they should be, I have to wonder? Stairs batted .289 last year and came into this season with a near .270 career average, he is batting .243 and Zaun (who is superior to Molina according to you) is batting .238 with 19 RBIs – is this really what you expected?
I think you get a little too excited about this Accardo thing, I mean you like to use WHIP and ERA as a measure and this year (albeit limited) Accardo has been plain awful. He had one solid season, last year although he blew a number of saves. Young yes, but a career ERA of 4.00 is nothing to get excited about. In my mind Vinnie Chulk is just as good, its close anyway.
Is Lyle Overbay really what you expected? During his good years he was a .290 20hr 45 doubles kinda guy, now he is not even close to that, I expected much more from him, we can differ on that, and Hill is what you expected? He is injured sure, but he was pretty bad this year. I am a big fan of Hill, but lets not go too crazy.
I also like how you pointed out this Keith guy is biased? Are you? Hmmm, most absolutely..
Sorry for the tirade here, but irrational was the theme of last nights Jays talk. You know what was the most entertaining. Is the guys that agreed with you, and said “I like JP” sounded like the biggest clowns, very out of touch with baseball.
Looking forward to seeing Marcum tonight, at least thats something! Later!
MW: Stairs is 40, and is hitting .252/.345/.404 against righties this year, which is not unreasonable to expect from him at 40. I would have though he’d be doing everything a little better, but I’m not surprised. Zaun has a .350 on-base, which is about what I expected – the RBIs have been a serious issue for him, or at least, hitting with RISP has been. Accardo has pitched 12 1/3 innings this year, though a pretty terrible 12 /13 innings, but that doesn’t mean anything. Last year, he had a 1.11 WHIP, and for his career, it’s 1.26, which tells me a lot more. Overbay has only hit 20 homers once, and he’s certainly not having the year that I expected – when have I ever said he was? I’m not biased, I’m fair.
- MatthewPhilosophical baseball question here. We often see teams play “no doubles” defense in the ninth inning up by one run. This includes guarding the lines and having the outfielders play deep. The concept is to not allow extrabase hits….this seems simple but it to me also seems simply flawed.
Up by one run in the ninth, the goal is to maximize your chance of giving up ZERO runs. Logically, if playing no doubles defense increases a teams chance of doing this, then WHY not play the same defense every inning? is it not the goal to allow zero runs most innings?
when teams are in conventional defense are they implicitily saying “we dont mind giving up one run here but we want to lessen the possibility of giving up a bunch of singles..so well play normal depth?” It makes no sense to me.
This ties in nicely with my second philosophical question. Is the runner on first base in the bottom of the ninth inning with a team down by two TRULY “meaningless?” I think not. That run is meaningless..but that runners position certainly is not..for several reasons.
1. the potential for a force out at second in a ball hit into the hole. (obvious and often stated by the announcers)
2. (and more esoteric)the runner servs as a “block” for the potential tying run at bat. if the runner at first gets to second on “indifference” and the batter then singles, this scores him and “clears” second base for the now tying run at first. instead of first and second..there is a runner on first and one run in…second base is ripe for the taking. essentially a two run deficit could evaporate with a couple of measely singles.
your thoughts.
MW: To your first point, the value of a single run increases exponentially in inverse proportion to the amounts of outs remaining. To the second, the run is meaningless, but I don’t think a runner on first should be handed second base.
- sammy jalalzaiMike, for every 10 callers that call into your show, you disagree with 11 of them. We as Blue Jays fans have a right to be frustrated with this team. I also listen to other post game shows and there are always callers complaining and ripping players, managers, general managers….and these teams I’m talking about are in first place!
What do you want fans to call in and say….”Oh well Mike another tough loss, we only scored one run today and went 0 for 25 with runners in scoring position, but hey, we know this team can hit from two years ago, were close!” or “Though Lyle Overbay hit into two inning ending double plays with the bases loaded, he did get two walks improving his on base percentage!! I’m going to buy my flex pack right away so I can go see Lyle Overbay Walk!!”
Fairly or unfairly if fans want to rip Lyle Overbay, they have that right, if Rolen is the whipping boy then Jays fans have that right too.
You don’t like it when Fans say that Overbay sucks, ‘he doesn’t suck’ is usually your response. What I find interesting is that you have the right to say a player sucks but not the listners. I’ll give you an example, earlier in the year you said Juan Pierre sucks and yes he’s had a bad couple of years. Lyle Overbay has had a couple of rough seasons but he doesn’t suck. Your argument is he can hit as he has in the past. Juan Pierre is second since 2000 or 2001 in hits only behind Ichiro, but you get to say he sucks, history doesn’t count with him but Lyle Overbay doesn’t suck because of history.
Fairly or unfairly if people want to rip J.P. then they have that right. J.P. has had seven years with a plan over Gord Ash who didn’t have one. As a Jays fan I don’t care what the plan is , the bottom line is Wins and Loses and a .500 team with a plan or without a plan is still a .500 team. Whether they were good moves or bad moves, he traded away fan favorites Reed Johnson and Orlando Hudson and he will be subject to criticism for that. He brought in A.J. Burnett, who people love to hate. He makes controversial comments (and Adam Dunn wasn’t the first time). He is not a well polished articulate guy and not a media darling and the media rip him for that. Except Mike Wilner of course. Comments like ‘I can get another job in Baseball anytime’ is not good. No doubt that’s true, he can. But why say it? Perception is that he doesn’t care…sometimes perception is stronger than reality.
For heaven’s sake Mike, for once just let the listeners have their way and tell them there right. That the Blue Jays Stink. People will love you for it.
MW: You know, I’ve often thought about coming on one night and just agreeing with everyone, no matter how ridiculous their comments are. It’d be funny, but I think the show would start to suck after about five minutes. The Blue Jays don’t stink – they’re three games under .500. What I don’t understand is the whole “fairly or unfairly” thing. If a caller makes a fair argument, I have no problem. But if someone is being unfair, why should I let that go? And why does the fact that callers rip everyone in other cities that have teams playing well mean I should agree with people who want to rip the Blue Jays unfairly? It’s my job to not let people get away with crap like that.
- JoeIt looks to me like Listch has lost much of the momentum that carried him to a 7-1 start. In fact, he reminds me a lot of Josh Towers a few years back that rolled off about 6-7 straight wins before crashing back to reality. He has not looked good in about 6 of his last 8 starts. In truth, as much as I admire his work ethic, I think in the coming off-season I would assess what interest other teams have in him and find a more consistent 5th starter (…contingent on how Purcey handles that role if given a chance this year).
MW: I think that if you’re looking for someone who’s significantly better than Litsch, then you’re not looking for a 5th starter.
- BrendonI think Rios is the AJ Burnett of position players. Million-dollar talent, 10 cent head. It appears that more than one batting coach–including I’m sure the late unlamented Gary Denbo–have asked him to make one small alteration to his mechanics. But it also appears that he knows better and trusts his approach just the way it is.
Hoorah for him.
MW: You think that he hasn’t changed his approach from last year to this?
- reyesHey Wilner, I think you can tell that this season is lost so I truly feel bad for you that you’ve got to watch this sad sack for the rest of the year. I for one am done with this club, as they will not get one more penny from me until there is a change. I’m not blaming all the ill’s on Ricardi as he has done some very good things, especially this pitching staff. However, to not have one meaningful game in seven years, is more than enough evidence that he should be gone.
I do enjoy your passion and committment to the Jays. Good Luck.
- BobbyMike, you seemed more annoyed than usual with the irrational, unreasonable callers. I should say though, that I really am entertained by the show, it never ceases to amaze me how dumb people can sound. If I was going to call in to live radio I would hope that I would have my thoughts straight and have a rational, reasonable argument or point to make. I read and listen everyday, keep up the amazing work. You’re what’s keeping me interested in the Jays despite this incredibly frustrating season. Thanks.
MW: Thanks! And yeah, I was in a bad mood last night regardless, but the callers certainly didn’t help.
- NickWow. Adam Lind is 4 for 4 and just hit that laser shot. Is it just me or has he been destroying LHP?
If Jays can pull this one out, they’re 14-10 in their last 24 with Burnett and Halladay up to finish the series. If they were to win those games, they’d head back home on a high note?
Mike, I remember a few weeks ago, you mentioned on Jays Talk that they Jays still had an outside shot, but they had very little room for error. Specifically you mentioned that they couldn’t have a 2-7 run or something like that. They haven’t done that yet.
Here’s to hoping.
MW: It’s just you. Going into tonight, Lind was hitting .261/.308/.391 against lefties. Of course, with tonight, he’s up to .370/.400/.630 – so now you’re right.
- ReneSomebody PLEEEEASE put Marcum back on the DL.
- MarcusWow, amazing game!
As for Rios’s approach, do you think he changed his approach? Because I mentioned earlier in the season that he seemed a lot ‘noiser’ at the plate and you told me he has always looked the same. I’ve read a couple of reports mentioning that hitting coaches over the years have had problems with the way he swings back slightly over his right foor when he hits so that he comes off the ball. He had a good night tonight, but he’s not off my hook yet. Not by a long shot!
Still, it was nice to see some hitting. And yea for Johnny Mac! One of my favourite players.
Getting back to Rios, yes, he has a terrific contract. And, yes, he’s not living up to all that potential. But I think there may be GMs out there who believe that at their club, Rios will blossom into the 5-tool powerhouse he has the talent to be. And they may be right. But he’s not working out too well here. I do think it’s an outside possibility that someone might take him off our hands.
MW: I think Rios is constantly fidgeting and working on ways to fix his issues at the plate, just like any hitter when he’s not producing the way he thinks he should be. But in no way do I think the Jays should be looking for someone to “take him off (their) hands.” That’s crazy.
- reyesMW: ‘ I think people want J.P. fired because they believe he should have known this team would underachieve.’
Very funny,
However every year, every GM in baseball tries to put together a winning team. JP Ricciardi is one of the few, maybe the only GM now employed in the majors who has gone seven years without even the possibility of a playoff appearance and has still kept his job.
That’s why we want him fired.
MW: Then you should look at the circumstances of the past seven years.
- reyesMW: Stairs is 40, and is hitting .252/.345/.404 against righties this year, which is not unreasonable to expect from him at 40. I would have though he’d be doing everything a little better, but I’m not surprised. Zaun has a .350 on-base, which is about what I expected – the RBIs have been a serious issue for him, or at least, hitting with RISP has been. Accardo has pitched 12 1/3 innings this year, though a pretty terrible 12 /13 innings, but that doesn’t mean anything. Last year, he had a 1.11 WHIP, and for his career, it’s 1.26, which tells me a lot more. Overbay has only hit 20 homers once, and he’s certainly not having the year that I expected – when have I ever said he was? I’m not biased, I’m fair.
Mike…you say you are fair? Doesn’t the above seem like cherry picking data to support what may be your flawed argument? Stairs stats vs. right handers? Lyle Overbay only hit 20 hr once? Why not mention when he only hit 16 homers he had 53 doubles 87 RBIs and a .385 obp? Or he had a 19 hr 72 RBI season (1 short of 20).
You only thing I have ever really ragged on you is the Zaun/Molina thing, the Gibbons needs to go thing (which is very clear with Cito making the team better without a doubt) and most recently that Rios will prove he is more valuable to his team than Linecum (over time). I am confident that I will be 3 for 3 here! Beware our next’tif…
Always fun to spar with you, great win tonight, Rios getting locked in.
Also, never forget when callers were begging JP and Gibby to bring Lind back you would defend Gibby/JP by saying he is 1-19! Give him time and a better manager and see what happens. As they say in the business world you cannot dispute results!
MW: Stairs is a platoon player, so why do his numbers against lefties matter? Overbay did hit only 20 homers once, but you said he should be expected to hit 20 homers every year. I never defended Gibby/JP by saying that Lind was 1 for 19, in fact I constantly said that he wasn’t given enough of a shot to prove anything. Thanks for listening!
- MatthewHi Mike,
Who are some of your all time favorite Expos? Personally, I go with guys such as Dawson, Raines, Wallach, Spike Owens, Dennis Martinez, and Larry Walker.
MW: Expos? I guess Larry Walker tops the list. I was always kind of partial to Bryn Smith, too, for some reason. And you mean Spike Owen.
- Dave JHi Mike
The baseball prospectus guys did forecast a below 500 record for the Jays. I was a bit more optimistic, but for the Jays to compete, Rios, Wells and Overbay really have to get back to their 2006 level, and who knows if that’s gonna happen. They just don’t have the track record of a guy like Pujols. Perhaps 2006 was just an aberration and not their true level. And the Jays are locked into these guys, so there’s no going back.
Personally, I would look real hard at fast tracking Scott Campbell, and seeing if Hill can play short in 2009. I really don’t think there are any SS solutions in the free agent market, given that Christian Guzman just got 8M a year for 2 years.
MW: I love people who make their arguments by comparing the Jays’ hitters to arguably one of the best hitters in the history of the game.
- Alex HThanks for the response, Mike.
I knew JP didn’t draft Overbay, but gave him credit from a draft perspective, because we wouldn’t have him without JP’s draft of Jackson and Bush (who I think we traded in the deal). Should’ve been more clear.
I still think Overbay’s lack of production is tough to stomach from a first baseman, but I guess we disagree.
That’s cool, though. Talking about baseball is part of what makes the game great.
MW: Then why not give him credit for all the other guys?
- MikeMike,
What is the stupidest thing you have ever said on the show?
If it wasn’t your claim that Jeremy Accardo was somehow a product of JP’s grand farm system, where would this comment rank?
MW: Hmmmm, considering that Accardo was acquired for Shea Hillenbrand (and, yes, Vinnie Chulk was thrown in), who was acquired for Adam Peterson, who Ricciardi picked in the 3rd round in 2002 – how is Accardo not a product of Ricciardi’s drafting? See, the stupid people don’t understand that sometimes players are selected in the draft in order to be future assets in trade.
- ProkopecMW: Overbay did hit only 20 homers once, but you said he should be expected to hit 20 homers every year.
What??????????????
Now I am going to pull a mike wilner, dont put words in my mouth mike! When did I say Overbay should hit 20 hrs every year? See below, I never said that. You said yesterday that Overbay is where “you expected him to be” I say are you nuts? I expected more from him this year, does not translate into me saying he should hit 20 homers every year?? Mike, you may be getting over blogged! I gaurantee you had I asked you at the beginning of the year to roughly project Overbays year, you would not have said “I expect a .270 avg. about 11 homers and 60 RBIS” dream on..
I wrote:
Is Lyle Overbay really what you expected? During his good years he was a .290 20hr 45 doubles kinda guy, now he is not even close to that, I expected much more from him, we can differ on that,
MW: OK, I apologize for not going back and looking specifically at what you wrote. But seriously, I’m not putting words in your mouth. You said that during his “good years” he was a 20hr +++ kind of guy. That would imply that you felt he was someone who could be counted on to hit 20 home runs in a season, would it not?
- MatthewHi Mike
My point was that the Jay’s core hitters need to take that extra step … and no one knows if they will. Maybe they will next year, maybe they won’t. Nothing in their history suggests a strong certainty (ie say 90%) that they will. If you look at Boston, they’ve survived Ortiz not being the Ortiz from the past few years for about 50 games, and then being injured. Boston has thrived because of guys like Youkilis and Drew taking a step up from last year. That’s what the Jays hitters need to do.
MW: Yes, they do. And thank you for not repeating the misplaced apostrophe.
- Alex HMy post was getting too long, and I didn’t want to make it a laundry list. But, you’re right, JP’s drafts directly and indirectly account for Janssen and Accardo. They’re both useful arms.
But, don’t you think it’s a stretch to give JP “credit” for Brian Tallet, John McDonald and Marco Scutaro? These guys are, at best, average players (McDonald is great defensively, for sure). By that logic – every GM deserves credit for anyone who steps foot on the field – whether they’re any good or not.
So, this is the comprehensive list of players who JP’s drafts have directly or indirectly contributed to the club:
Overbay
Hill
Marcum
Lind
Janssen
Accardo
Tallet
McDonald
Scutaro
I’m not trying to be difficult – but do you really think that’s such an impressive return for seven years?
You’re looking at an above average second baseman (maybe), a potential number two starter, a below average first baseman, a potentially good, but still unproven, outfield bat, a couple utility players and a couple middle relievers.
I’d argue that almost every team has amassed at least that type of return in the last seven years.
Independent reviews of the Blue Jays farm system seem to agree, don’t they? Baseball Prospectus refers to a “lack of talent in the Jays’” system counts only one Blue Jays farm hand (Snider) among its top 100 prospects.
I’m not sold. What am I missing?
MW: Do some comprehensive studies of some other teams that have drafted in the middle of the rounds most years. I’d be surprised if you came up with many that are significantly better.
- MikeLOL
M-Dub
comment 87.
you’re a genius.
By that logic we could also say Accardo is a product of Bavasi’s farm….all chips in the big game right?
gimme a break man. JP is doing nothing but playing musical chairs. He’s trying to complete a math problem through process of elimination not by knowing the formula.
does X = 2…no
does x = 3..no
4?
5?
6?
7?
8?
500?
3000000000?
MW: I have no idea what you’re talking about.
- slobberfaceHey Mike,
5th poster forgot to mention another thing that I’m sure p***es you off.
Ask Mike how he’s doing today on Jay’s talk!
- Andrew‘MW: And I certainly wouldn’t take that bet, I think the odds are against him returning though it continues to puzzle me as to why the can wouldn’t have been tied to him already if his bosses were sure he’s not coming back. You’re right, often there is a critical mass that develops because of a mob mentality, but that doesn’t mean the mob is right.’
This was your response to Alex, and I agree with every word in his post. So let me posit a possible reason why Ricciardi isn’t already on his bike.
It’s very simple. They haven’t decided who to hire yet. They don’t necessarily want rookie phenom Anthopoulos to take over right now. The phone hasn’t been ringing off the hook looking for trades, so further mistakes haven’t been made. And there’s been enough drama to last everyone for months. The team isn’t likely to go to the playoffs. So I think they’re playing out the string until the end of the season, after which Ricciardi will be handed his hat and his box of photos and shown the door. If Godfrey survives, then JP will know finally at first hand what it feels like when the man above you shafts you to keep his own job.
As for this comment to me:
‘MW: Then you should look at the circumstances of the past seven years.’
I’ve looked. I’ve been there. I’ve had season tix for a lot longer than seven years. Yes, the team was in a mess from the Gord Ash era. Yes, he was told to cut payroll. So no, we didn’t expect too much in the first few years. But then the payroll was increased. A lot. And that happened three or four years ago I think. The bottom line on the past seven years is this:
3rd place+/- with one last place and a very possible second last place finish coming up. One 2nd place but nowhere near the wild card. On average over those seven years his club that he put together has finished down more than it’s finished up. And in the process he has iced three managers. Previously you could have made the argument that it’s impossible to dislodge the Yankees and the Sox. But as of right now, the Rays are proving that it can be done for a good part of the season at least.
MW: I don’t think you’re right on the first point. They could easily install Tony LaCava on an interim basis if they didn’t want J.P. around. He was one of the architects of the Colon for Sizemore/Lee/Phillips deal. If the phone’s not ringing off the hook, the Jays should be making some calls. The payroll was increased a lot pre-2005, but too late to use it that year, so look at ’06 (second place), ’07 (ravaged by injury) and ’08 (crappy year).
- reyesI have composed a list of top 10 things that p*** mike wilner off
1 – catch him in a contradition (which is very easy to do)
2 – call him a liar when he misquotes stats in his favor
3 – misquote him
4 – call aj a .500 pitcher
5 – criticize lyle overratedbay
6 – tell him that anton, terry, vito, and neil all have more baseball knowledge than him
7 – ask him if he is a believer in tbay yet
8 – tell him that obp is not the most important stat in baseball
9 – tell him that derek jeter is the greatest defensive shortstop
10 – call him JP’s lap dog
MW: I would say “be an idiot” is at the top of the list.
Is AJ not a .500 pitcher…or really cose to it?
MW: Yes, he is. But that doesn’t mean anything.
- KDMike,
I am puzzled by your defense of JP’s drafting record. While it has not been terrible, as some fans suggest, it has not been good either. How many all-star appearances have JP draftees made in his seven years? I don’t know the answer to this but i suspect the number is very low. This is obviously an indictment of his early drafting and not so much his recent drafts.
I am not a JP hater. He’s probably an average GM in my books. But for strictly marketing reasons, I think he will be let go. The team has underachieved two seasons in a row (pick your excuse) and the fans (at least the discriminating ones) are losing interest in this team.
I rarely listen or read your work but have noticed you increasingly refer to callers/writers as stupid or idiots. Do you think that is a very professional way to conduct yourself?
MW: It depends, but I think that sports is the “toy department” of journalism. I’m not here to be an old-time reporter, I’m here to provide opinion, and often, that’s my opinion.
- MMMike please disregard my earlier long post about Ricciardi. I just finally managed to listen to Jays Talk and I can see why you’re upset. We’re all bagging on Ricciardi, and I understand what you are saying about his trading/drafting etc. That post is just another diatribe.
I will give you what I think is a good, uncrazy, reasonable reason as to why I don’t think JP’s right for the job. And that is this: he can’t stop meddling. He signs Reed Johnson to a decent contract, gets a chance at Shannon Stewart, signs him, releases Reed. He gives John MacDonald a decent contract, gets a chance at David Eckstein and signs him as the everyday shortstop. Macdonald is benched. He has Greg Zaun as an everyday catcher, with a decent contract, but he gets the chance of Rod Barajas, signs him. And now Zaun is keeping MacDonald company on the bench.
Is he wrong to do any of these things? Barajas is proving to have more power than Zaun. In retrospect the Stewart for Johnson thing was a wash. Macdonald–and in this I agree with you–is a better everyday shortstop than David Eckstein. So two out of three of those moves didn’t work.
But worse, of those original players, maybe only MacDonald was a problematic starter and that was because of his bat. Before the season, we had Rios, Wells and Thomas as our big three batters al of whom could hit the ball hard. We had Stairs on the bench who had had an excellent year in ’07. We had Overbay who didn’t have a good year in ’07, but he was injured. In general he was a good hitter. We had Hill at 2nd base who had hit the ball well. You’re right when you say that Ricciardi had no reason at all to believe that the hitters would go south. We could have carried Johnson and MacDonald easily if the main part of the offense was hitting well. And Zaun is a better defensive catcher than Barajas.
So why did he make those moves? They weren’t necessary. And the message they sent to the other players was ‘no one’s safe’. That was born out by the unsurgical removal of Frank Thomas. It’s hard to play well when you think your job’s on the line every time you go out to bat. That’s what Cito Gaston meant when he said that some of the guys were not doing well because they weren’t sure of their position on the ball club. I’m pretty certain that all the stuff going on at the beginning of the season, from the Johnson ouster to the Thomas ouster, had a bad effect on morale, and that translated into a bad effect on the offense.
You might argue that Ricciardi was just trying to improve his team. I think that’s the case. But I would also say that Ricciardi is a hyper-reactive personality. We’ve seen evidence of that many times on your show and elsewhere. He sees something shiny and goes after it. If it doesn’t turn out to be so shiny, he’ll pull it down, throw it away and go after something else.
That’s not a good way to manage a baseball club. So I think he should be replaced by someone a little less hot on the trigger.
MW: I couldn’t disagree with you more. I think that a GM should always be looking to improve his team wherever and however he can, And I think that it translates into the clubhouse with players thinking, “wow – any chance to improve the team is pounced on, that’s awesome” rather than “oh crap, I might be the one to go next.” And if it is the latter, then it should be followed with “I’d better play as well as I possibly can.”
- reyesfrom post # 69…
Quote:
Regarding JP (oh, no, not again). I don’t think he is a terrible manager but when you are in the eastern conference, when you have to compete with the Yankees and Boston, where they can burry a mistake by just signing another free agent, you need a genius GM, and I don’t think JP is one.
MW: Eastern conference?
~Unquote~
why do you have to do this? you know exactly what he’s talking about, yet feel the need to try and make the person feel stupid about a mild slip up…and then you wonder why people are quick to call in or write to correct you or catch you in perceived contradictions?
you’re forwarded as much respect as you give out, and for as great a job as you do here and on the radio, you really present yourself with an unwarranted sense of self importance…you’re not pat gillick just yet, so the condescending responses only make for good reading/listening for so long until they just turn you into a joke…
i apologize if the perceived tone of this post is malicious, but the habit you have of responding to ppl the way you did to #69 is simply rude and belittling…get over yourself and show SOME appreciation to the people that make your blog as entertaining as it is…
with all that said, when you engage in level headed dialogue with people, i find you very informative, so on that front, keep up the good work…
MW: Sorry, I’m going to keep doing that, just like I keep pouncing on the puckheads who call in and talk about “unrestricted” free agents. Know the game, respect the terminology.
- Jay BHi Mike:
RE: My comments on July 22nd, 2008 at 6:55 pm. (Brendon)
It would seem the Jays share my sentiments….Listch was just sent down to the minors and I suspect will be looking at a more consistent replacement in the off-season (well, in truth, he has been consistent….either consistently good (start of season) or consistently bad…but the trajectory of his progress has been in the wrong direction!)
- Brendon