12:45 AM Eastern
How amazing is it that the Blue Jays can come back from 3-0 down in the bottom of the ninth to force extra innings, finish up a homestand 5-2 and still leave everyone with such a horrifying taste in their mouths?
Jesse Litsch had a great start, retiring the first 14 he faced on the way to seven innings of five-hit, three-run ball – his third straight start without issuing a walk. In the bottom of the 9th, the Jays touched up Troy Percival, a guy who had given up just three BASERUNNERS in 11 innings so far this season. Vernon Wells hit a mammoth two-run home run, Lyle Overbay hit his second double of the night and Aaron Hill scored Overbay’s pinch-runner with a solid single. The ballpark had woken up from a 2 1/2 hour slumber, and things looked they were going the Jays’ way. A 6-1 homestand, a series win against the Rays were all in the offing, especially when Alex Rios led off the 10th with a triple.
Rios flew around the bases on that hit, by the way. When he gets the motor going, he can pick ‘em up and put ‘em down with the best of them. It was beautiful to watch – but I figured that he’d probably wind up going another 90 feet at some point. Shannon Stewart struck out looking, the Greatest Blue Jay Ever was intentionally walked, Matt Stairs struck out swinging, Vernon Wells got the old unintentional intentional walk, and then Rod Barajas (in to play first because Overbay had been run for) struck out. Ugly with a capital ugh.
It was reminiscent of the 14-inning game with the Rangers back on April 16th, when the Jays rallied with three in the bottom of the 8th to tie it and Joe Inglett couldn’t get the suicide squeeze down in the bottom of the 10th that would have won it.
This time, there was no A.J. Burnett coming out of the ‘pen, it was Shawn Camp, who could have picked a much better time for his first normal human outing of the season. Camp had been fantasmic since being called up from Syracuse, allowing two hits and no walks while striking out 7 in 5 2/3 innings, but tonight the grounders found holes, the Jays couldn’t execute a rundown and Alex Rios airmailed a throw home on a fly ball. All before the two-out Slam by Dioner Navarro on a 3-2 pitch made it academic. Not that it probably wasn’t already. You can’t hang this one on Camp, not at all. At some point the overwhelming craptacularity of the hitters has to turn around. Honest, it will. It’s just getting harder and harder to believe as each day goes by.
There will be a new face on the squad tomorrow night in Cleveland. David Eckstein and John McDonald are both on the DL, but only one has been replaced. There will be a ton of stories Friday morning about who might be coming up or coming over, but my (figurative) money is on Brad Wilkerson.
Released by the Mariners last week after starting the season .232/.348/.304, Wilkerson has long been a guy that J.P. Ricciardi has liked. In fact, Ricciardi almost traded Rios for him once upon a time. He’s a left-handed bat, but when he’s doing well, he’s actually a better hitter against left-handed pitching. Problem is that he hasn’t done really well since ripping up his shoulder back when he was with the Expos in 2004. Of course, had he been doing really well since, he wouldn’t be available for free.
There has been discussion in the comments section about who this new bat would be, and I said that I’d prefer to take a shot with a guy like Jason Botts over Wilkerson, because Wilkerson hasn’t been good for so long, but Botts cleared waivers today, so the Jays obviously didn’t think the same thing. My guess is that Wilkerson is in there playing left tomorrow night in Cleveland, with Shannon Stewart DHing.
Yes, Stewart looked terrible tonight, but you can’t pin this thing on him. The Jays were 1-for-11 with runners in scoring position, and outside the 9th inning, were terrible. Matt Stairs said after the game that in that 10th inning situation with Rios at third and one out, he himself “sucked a**”, but I don’t think Stairs alone should bear the sins of the multitude. They all did, and they all have most of the season. It’s embarrassing already.
Still, a 5-2 homestand off a 2-7 road trip is pretty good stuff. But what a disgusting way to close it out.
Comments are encouraged, and since the Jays are hitting the road I’ll have a little more time in my day, so I’ll be able to get to them earlier on (hopefully) – let’s keep the JaysTalk going 24/7!
88 Responses to “Sheer Unadulterated Ridiculosity”
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Hey Mike,
If the Jays sign Wilkerson, how do you think they’ll use him in the long-term? Just as another bat off the bench/fourth outfielder now that Lind is back in Syracuse? Or will he get more playing time than most of the bench guys as a sort of part-time LF/DH platoon-er?
MW: He’ll definitely play against lefties, and give Stewart a breather against some righties – if it’s him.
- TyCan the Jays win the Wild Card with Shannon “let’s watch strike three go right down the can” Stewart in a premier offensive position? We aren’t exactly stacked at the other positions either…
Hopefully Wilkseron hits his way into the full-time job but I have my reservations.
Sorry for the condescending tone, Mike, but this loss was frustrating to say the least! We had a bad offense last year and did nothing but add Eckstein and pray for better health in the offseason. Why JP never addressed this part of the club is beyond me…
MW: I think he thought, as I did, that most of the poor offensive performances were due to injury, especially since the same hitters had been so good the year before. The Jays also added Scott Rolen in the off-season, and Stewart was hardly the only one who struck out last night.
- Matt SBrad Wilkerson? Really? He’s the answer? If the answer is another middling outfielder, what happened to the promise of Buck Coats?
Wilkerson might not cost anything, but in some cases, you get what you pay for.
Also, I hate being the fan who calls in with trade proposals… but in your opinion Mike, would the Buccos at least listen to an offer of Lind/Purcey for Jason Bay? This team is (supposed to be) built to win now, and it’s becoming pretty obvious the Jays are an impact bat short. Bonus points for Bay also fitting the Can-con that Godfrey pines for….if not, Tike Redman is always available. Boo-ya.
MW: The Buccos would jump at an offer of Lind/Purcey for Jason Bay, I think, but I’m inclined to hold onto that arm for now, just because he seems to really be coming into his own. Wilkerson (or whoever it is) isn’t being brought in to be the saviour/jumpstart guy, that would be Bonds and they don’t want to do that. All they’re looking for is someone to platoon with Stairs. If this team is going to win, they’re going to have to start hitting. One add isn’t going to change that.
- JCMike,
I understand you have been saying the offense will come around and such, but I think it is now time to do something, and that something should not be Brad Wilkerson. This team may once again not play a meaningful game in September, with this rotation, that would be a tragedy of epic proportions. With Burnett opting out in the offseason, our staff may very well not be as good next year. I’m not a big advocate of “mortgaging the future” but if there ever was a time to do it, I think it’s now. If this team gets some help for the offense, and makes the playoffs, they may well have a better chance than anybody to win the damn thing, with this staff. The time is now.
- TerryMW..todays game almost drove me to finally call…but alas I ran out of time.
Lets play a little game called
“Who would you rather have?”
Stats are as follows,
PA/Avg/OBP/BB/K/SLG
PLAYER A
2005 661/248/351/84/147/405
2006 365/222/306/37/116/422
2007 389/234/319/43/107467
Player B
2005 406/335/392/32/41/420
2006 522/301/360/45/42/403
2007 559/296/367/56/51/414
Now, to me, several things become very clear.
1. This is NOT a small sample size.
2. Player A is not only fairing much worse, but his trends are downright scary.
3. Player A just gets out WAY too much by any reasonable measure.
4. Player B is an above average player in most respects relative to the league..let alone vs player A.
5. Player B would be a perfect person for the Jays as he would fit nicely at the top of the order.
Some factoids that are important. Both players are freely available talent and could likely both be had for a similar amount of money. Both are outfielders and left handed bats.
I thinks its INSANE to go for player A when player B is sitting right there..even though i trashed player B to you just a little while ago..LOL
Player A is obviously Wilkerson, player B Kenny Lofton. Now you’ve said that Wilkerson actually hits lefties better than righties…That may be true but its like saying Pyhllis dillar looks hotter in plaid than in denim…
MW: Congrats, it’s our first Phyllis Diller reference. Awful spelling, but what can you do, I guess. Thing is, they’re looking for someone to platoon with Stairs, someone who can hit lefties. Kenny Lofton can’t do that. Wilkerson’s not my first choice (and it may not be him), but Lofton doesn’t fit that bill at all.
- sammy jalalzaiBrad Wilkerson as the much awaited lefty masher eh? Colour me unimpressed. He has a career .818 OPS against LHP and .796 against RHP. Not exactly the platoon lefty masher I was thinking of. I was thinking more along the lines of Kevin Mench who hits LHP at .305/.361/.563!! He’s younger and I assume just as easy to get as Wilkerson.
MW: Mench isn’t as freely available. I’d have preferred him, too. Still, we don’t know that it’s Wilkerson.
- ShawnI didn’t get to see the game tonight but by the sounds of it, I saved myself a lot of heartache.
I’ve been thinking about the comment posted on Sunday’s entry asking about the Doc’s chances of getting into the Hall of Fame. I agree with your answer and that’s led my thoughts in three directions:
1. Dave Stieb should be in the hall. The reason he isn’t is because he spent his career with a team that wouldn’t give him run support and didn’t win a championship.
2. IIRC, the biggest driving force behind the ’93 championship was the desire to get rings for Molitor and Carter.
3. As an artist, I’ve seen first hand how people will find that little bit extra if they’re working on a project that is bigger than themselves.
Remember during spring training the Star would print an Q&A each day with a player? The Doc said he could die happy if he had a world series ring. It broke my heart.
I wonder how this team would play if they chose as their goal to get that ring for him. We know they all greatly admire and respect him. These days when I watch a game my silent mantra is “win it for the Doc”. What a beautiful thing it would be if the team did the same. And I believe it would be more effective than they could possibly imagine.
Would this even be a possibility?
MW: I don’t think Halladay would want that kind of attention, nor do I think that would work – but you and I have different ideas about that little bit extra. Carter already had a ring from ’92, by the way. I think the reason that Stieb isn’t in the Hall of Fame is because he didn’t pitch well enough for long enough. He had a 7-year peak in the ’80s, then a couple of very bad years followed by three more really good ones. He’s not a Hall of Famer.
- MKMike,
I am so frustrated I can’t sleep. I ended up staying until the bitter end. I can’t believe the number of people that left in extra innings when the game was tied. If you’re going to do that, why don’t you just leave when they are down by three??? I’ll never understand leaving a game early!
I know that you keep saying the offense will come around and I want to believe, but how long would you wait until doing something drastic? What measures would you take (after passing that magic point where you thought something else needed to be done)?
Thanks.
MW: I would have signed Barry Bonds a month ago.
- GlennYes the hitting will get better.
But the larger point remains that this is not a good offensive team. While they figure to remain in the top half in team OBP (despite the loss of OBP machine Frank Thomas), they project to be in the bottom third in team slugging.
Beyond Vernon Wells, who else is likely to hit 25+ homeruns? Rios and Rolen look like they’ll end up in the 20-25 range, Overbay and Hill will probably make it to the teens. At LF and SS they figure to be significant below average (slugging) for those positions.
Is there an infusion of hitting talent around the corner? I certainly hope there is, otherwise the Jays don’t have the horses to keep themselves in the race.
The other question is – can average hitting and great pitching win you a playoff spot in this league. Maybe; we’ll see.
MW: I don’t think there’s any question that average hitting and great pitching can win you a playoff spot. If the Jays had even average hitting, they’d probably have six or so more wins already.
- Robert DudekWilkerson is not a bad guess but it would very much disappoint me. Surely we can do better.
- WillRainMike, I know you’ve long discounted the existence of ‘clutch hitting’ – has this display change your mind?
MW: I have NEVER discounted the existence of clutch hitting, I have discounted the existence of clutch hitters.
- PaulGreat blog, I’m not a computer guy but I make an exception in this case. Two things, Barajas did a good job of turning two but on that single in the 13th where he was holding the runner, was that grounder gettable (even for Barajas)? Secondly, I love Stewart and he is a proven pro-hitter I’m surprised he couldn’t get it done in the 10th. I believe he will return to form soon (that 3 for 4 was a good start) but after that strikeout great pitching and props to Joe Maddon for pulling the right strings
MW: Barajas had no chance at all on that single. Overbay would have had it, but Barajas wasn’t getting close.
- owenIs there a link between Johnny Mac’s injury and the artificial turf. Would this same injury have occurred if it was natural grass. Finally,is there any way the Rogers Centre could actually put in real grass. All the players would love to play on that too.
MW: I don’t know if that injury would have happened on grass. This FieldTurf is supposed to have almost the same kind of “give” as grass, so there’s no way to really know. No, Rogers Centre can’t put real grass in.
- AndrewAgree with everything you said Mike. These loses are frustrationg though. I can not believe this team will have “turned the corner” until they start winning the games they are supposed to win. They held the Yankees to 1 for 17 with RISP the first series of the year, yet somehow found a way to lose two of three. They held the Red Sox to 3 runs in three games last week and still found a way to lose two of three. Tonight, runner on third, none out and the next five batters failed to put the ball in play. The truth is, a good team with an October in its future finds ways to win games like these and the Jays just have not exhibited this tendency. I don’t care if it is May, the next 10 games on the road are crucuial. A bad road trip coupled with the Red Sox knack for winning everyday could leave this team ten games out. They just came home and won five of seven, yet still lost ground on Boston. I really do believe these next ten games are the “moment of truth” for this club. They are in Cleveland for four games starting Friday night and these two clubs are a mirror image of each other. The Indians had two thirds of their line-up hitting under .220 yesterday and they are struggling to score runs. They cannot give any more great pitching performances away. The turn-around must start now.
Sorry if this ran too long.
MW: That’s nothing compared to some of the essays I’ve gotten here. I would only dispute the whole “a good team……….finds ways to win games like these.” That’s simply not true at all.
- Jim BranscomeI’m lost for words! I know its been said before but its becoming like last season all over again, only worse. Who of these position players even derserves to be anywhere near the All Star game (maybe Rolen} I can’t help thinking that JP has lucked out a little with the pitching staff, last year the Jays would have sunk without trace if Marcum hadn’t come from the pen and been outstanding {06 offerred no real indication of what he would go on to acheive} The same with MacGowan, i thought at the time they were close to giving up on him when he finally figured it out, both got their chance out of sheer desperation and they both worked out, same with Litcsh. We’ll struggle to go 4-6 on this next trip. Always apprieciate the opportunity to mouth off Mike, not to many opportunitys in the uk, (I suffer in silence!}
MW: Funny how people say J.P. “has no plan” but then attribute the emergence of Marcum and McGowan to luck.
- Phil SmithPlease excuse my ignorance, when the Jays released Hurt they were on the hook for his entire 08 salary, apart from the ML minimum when Oakland picked him up {Billy Beane must love JP} does the same apply if the Jays aquire Wilkerson?
MW: Yup, Seattle will be on the hook for him.
- Phil SmithHello Mike. Ouch, ouch, ouch. And while you’re right, Stairs can’t take it all on his shoulders, I think his quote is bang on and can be expanded to cover anybody in the batter’s box with RISP. Except for maybe Rolen and Wells, but if they won’t pitch to them, they won’t.
I feel it’s extra disheartening because it really shouldn’t have made it as far as extra innings at all. Sure, I like a ninth inning rally as much as the next girl, but Rios in the tenth wasn’t exactly the first time we had a guy on third, with batters still to go. If we’d cashed them in, heroics wouldn’t have been necessary.
I do have a question about the tenth inning though, specifically Well’s at bat. Maybe we’re just being conspiracy theorists here, but all four of those pitches were in the dirt, and after the first one, it looked kind of like Navarro made them look a bit wilder than he had too. It almost looked as though he was daring Rios to take a chance so they could get him at the plate. I think Rios is an incredible ball player and I’m glad we’ve kept him, but he does seem a bit of a hot head, and impetuous on the base paths every now and then. Does this seem like something viable the Rays were trying, or are our imaginations overactive? Thanks, and don’t worry about the comments too early, take a nap or something!
MW: Definitely an overactive imagination. It’s hard to block balls in the dirt, and the chance that one will get away isn’t worth the risk of that sort of a play.
- kitaMike,
I was wondering if you could explain why picthers can’t lick their fingers on the mound. I think it has something to do with trying to put a substance on the ball, but what could they have in their mouth that they can use?
MW: Ummmm, saliva.
- Zachary1. COME ON! For the love of Otis Nixon: Hit already!
2. I think that Curtis Thigpen is soooo depressed about the fact that JP thinks Rod Frickin’ Barajas is a better player than him that he can barely summon enough energy to go on LET ALONE hit a breaking ball.
3. How does your teams #2,3,4,5 & 6 hitters fail to bring in a runner from third with nobody out in extra innings in a game that you came back from a three run defecit against the other teams borderline hall of fame closer? How does that happen?
4. EDWIN FRICKIN’ JACKSON
5. I know it didn’t happen last night, but since when does Eric Hinske hit one off the windows?
6. O.K. maybe Percival’s not borderline hall of fame, but he has had a GREAT career and has been AWESOME all year.
7. If they put Brad Wilkerson in left over Adam Lind, I will shoot myself in the face. (I’ll only use a water pistol. Maybe even a super soaker.) Wilkerson licks his own buttocks to the tune of .230 or so every year. Yah he walks, but so does my grandmother. If they’re going to have somebody suck, let that somebody at least have some frickin’ upside. Wilkerson hasn’t had upside since the Simpson’s were culturally relevant.
MW: The Simpsons are no longer culturally relevant? Damnit! To your second answer, it was only the 2 hitter who failed to bring in a runner from third with nobody out, though I get the drift. But remember, 3 was intentionally walked and 5 basically was, too, and 6 wasn’t a starter. So it’s really only 2 and 4.
- peteThere have been a handful of times this season and last where I truly believed I might see a Jays pitcher throw a no hitter. (Of course, by just thinking that I jinxed it.) A lot of great pitchers go their whole career without one, and much of it has to do with the vagaries of the MLB schedule and catching lighting in a bottle, but if you had to put your money on one of these five guys to toss a no-no, who would it be?
MW: It’d be Burnett, because he already did.
- Rob_NSA reaL tough one to swallow! Bottom the 10th – the Jays had just had an incredible 9th at the plate – they to be so pumped after that! Bottom of the 10th Rios a triple – the meat of the order coming up – yea! Man I was smiling to myself as I listened to one after the other come up and go down!
Not seeing the game but listeneing to how they were pitching Wells I might have been tempted to send Rios home on a steal with those pitches going into the dirt and off the catcher – not sure how far off the catcher or plate they were going but there was more than one and with Walkers delivery it may have been doable! You can’t beat the element of surprise but I also realize you can’t take the bat out of a hitters hand – however knowing the hitting history of late – it might have been worth a gamble with none out and still have a couple of base runners if it failed!
It sounded like Stewart was disinterested in his turns at bat all night long – just when Rios hits – Hill hits – Stairs goes south (not to blame him at all – but what bad timing). The Rays bench boss called a good game in the 10th for sure as to Rolen and Wells – he must have had some insight on how Barajas was going to embarass himself at the plate.
Camp – too bad he had to save this outing for last night – he gave into Navarro with a full count and bases loaded – walking in a run at that point would not have been that big a deal in hind sight of course – however at the same time you don’t want to “give in” to an MLB hitter at any time with a pitch they can bury into the stands.
Scutaro I thought did a pretty good job at SS and for sure at the plate over the last two games. Albeit he messed up on a tag during that rundown in the fatefull inning – what a complete mess that was.
Tough way to head out on a road trip after a still terrific home stand – would have been better all around to loose this one in the ninth rather than tie it up and blow the opportunity to win it in the tenth.
I look at it however this way – if getting a lead off hitter to 3rd in the 10th after a fantastic comeback in the 9th – the meat of the order to come and not scoring him – well – if that doesn’t wake up this offence under those circumstances – then nothing will and it will be a long season. I think to a man they will disucuss it and come out swinging for the good on this road trip. Sometimes bad events happen to bring out the best! Thanks.
MW: I don’t think it would have been a great idea to ask Rios to try to steal home. Actually, you’re asking for disaster if you do that. If it fails, which it probably does, you have a runner on first and two out – although you might prefer that situation if you’re the Jays. And please, enough with the “looks disinterested”. It’s just such a ridiculous thing to say.
- BobJust because C.C is pitching you can’t sit Stairs out. And whom for, Stewart? No way!I think Stairs should be the everyday DH(everyday means everyday), let him heat up. I am predicting a successful road trip. Blue Jays will play .600 ball on this trip and you heard it right here.
And finally Gibby has to rotate the bullpen properly. Frasor pitching after 14 days and Tallet after 12? Sure, the starters have been on fire but you can’t keep guys idle for so long or can you?
MW: They both did fine, so I guess you can. But yes, Stairs should sit against lefties, especially against the great ones.
- BeburgHi, Mike:
I think I was most disappointed last night with Matt Stairs — it’s hard to believe that he couldn’t even make contact in the 10th! Maybe it’s good that the Jays will face 3 LHP’s in Cleveland — I think Matt needs a day or two off.
On another subject, I agree with pinchrunning for Overbay in the 9th (otherwise it would never have gone into extras), but we sure missed his defense on the Iwamura ground ball in the 13th. Looked to me like it was only about 6 feet away from Barajas, but he never moved for it. I think Overbay gets that ball, gets at least a force at second, and … who know, maybe they’re still playing!
MW: Stairs strikes out a lot, and never wants to, so it’s not like he can pick the time when to not do it. It’s true about Overbay, but you’re not in the position to lose in the 13th if he doesn’t get pinch-run for.
- NormI hope your last line is (at least partly) prophetic — “The Jays are hitting….”
- NormBrad Wilkerson. Better start planning the parade. Where have you gone Pat and Cito?
- Chris JonesMike,
All I have to say is wow. I am not sure how adding another struggling bat is going to lift this offense. What the Jays need is a legit threat, not a “maybe we can close our eye, cross our fingers, click our heals and count to three and everything will be alright”. I have always looked at teams playing Wilkerson as being desperate giving his low batting average and large number of Ks. Its hard to know who is available but I dont think that is the answer and I am hoping J.P. is going in a different direction.
That being said something has to be done. Last night when Inglett ran for Overbay I debated that move in my head. With Overbay out and the Jays don’t really have a guy that fill in and should you get to his spot in the line-up in extras you’ll miss him. But of course you need to get there first. Right now the Jays bench looks terribly thin. This might be another reason for looking at Brad W because he can play a little 1st.
Do you think it is to early for J.P. to be agressive? I can’t help but feel that if the Jays don’t pull something to shake things up now they’ll find themselves about 8 games back of the wild card in august with 6 teams to jump. Not out of the race, but not really in it either. And thinking long term, this O isn’t likely to be any better next year, unless Lind turns into a superstar.
MW: I think it’s probably too early for other teams, not for J.P. Tough to find a dance partner in early May, though.
- JWThe ” Big Tease” continues! They almost pulled it off! They should have won! Where is the imagination with this team? They have Rios on 3rd with no one out in the 10th and they can’t cash him in.Now I am not the manager but it seems to me if you are having a hard time getting hits with runners in scoring position a squeeze bunt to the right side with Rios’ speed has a pretty good chance of scoring the winning run.These are the games they have to win. Imagine if they miss a playoff spot by ONE game… all they will say is woulda, coulda, shoulda!
Leigh
MW: I wouldn’t ask Shannon Stewart to bunt. He’s only sacrificed successfully 5 times in the 21st Century.
- leigh cockburnHi Mike – When Jerry says Allen is “up to call the next couple” – is he really just getting Allen prepared to take over for him next season – and would you maybe slide in next to Allen next season?
MW: Not at all. Alan gets to call the 3rd, 4th and 7th, and in extra innings he and Jerry switch off. I don’t think Jerry is planning on going anywhere.
- Andrew SorlieMike,
I went on MLB.com and got the stats I asked you for yesterday.
Why wouldn’t they have attempted the suicide squeeze with Stewart last night? He was struggling, why not give it a shot. What was needed was a patented Tony Fernandez slap bunt to force the shortstop or second baseman to play it.
Let’s hope we catch Cleveland on an off weekend. We shouldn’t have to count on Halladay, McGowan and Burnett to pitch shutouts to win the game.
MW: Cleveland hasn’t been hitting all year. They didn’t need a patented Tony Fernandez slap, all you need is contact and not to pop the ball up on a suicide squeeze, but I already answered why they didn’t do it.
- Aaron KerSo while Bonds remains unemployed, the Blue Jays continue to look through other team’s recycling box like some homeless guy who could really use a dime.
If the season continues like this, I pin this on Godfrey with his small town cheapness and his suck up relationship with Selig.
MW: Small town cheapness? The payroll is about $98 million.
- Jim BTo be honest with you Mike, I couldn’t figure out how Percival was getting the job done and was glad to see the Blue Jays put up three runs on him.
That being said, I was embarrassed for this team seeing that display in the bottom of the 10th with Rios standing on third with nobody out. I hope they are embarassed as well!
Now I face a day of ridicule from a colleague who is a Red Sox fan.
MW: Sorry about that. But it’s well-deserved.
- DerekMike,
We can only hope J.P. Richardi is fired. He has a knack of picking has bins. He should never platooned left field and traded for a true bat in the off season not has bins.
MW: What does J.P.’s famous bin collection have to do with his work as a general manager? So he has a lot of bins, so what?
- brunoWe Toronto fans have been lucky to see such amazing pitching performances night after night after night. But the price we have to pay to see these pitching clinics is, of course, watching the Jays offense. Spotty at best, and white hot garbage at worst, the hitting has not been, to use a technical phrase, ‘any good’.
The thing is, the lineup is solid. Wells, Rios, Rolen, Hill, and Overbay form a productive core. And guys like Stewart and Eckstein are good contact hitters, with an ability to move runners along. But the move from ‘on paper’ to ‘on the field’ is a big one.
That being the case, how much responsibility should hitting caoch Gary Denbo be taking? He was brought in to take the hitting to the next level, and, well, he hasn’t. WIth such an underperforming O, shouldn’t Denbo be getting his resume in order?
Or am I overstaing his influence? Does a hitting coach have a significant impact at the major league level?
1. He’s dealing with professional, veteran players who have had success in the Bigs long before Denbo came to the team. That must limit how far he can push his philosophies with them.
2. Hitting fundamentals are hitting fundamentals, are they not? I mean, what can Denbo be saying that Mickey Brantley wasn’t? “We’re going to go in a new direction this year, boys. It may sound strange, but I want you to try to NOT swinging wildly at the first three pitches you face, and I really want you to look into NOT making outs. It’s real ‘outside the box’ thinking here, but trust me…”
Does Denbo deserve criticism? Or is luck just not being a lady?
MW: I’m going with the latter here. You answered your own question very well, though.
- Kipps ThompsonHey Mike,
I know that hindsight is 20/20, and I know that it did not work the last time that they tried it. However, why not try a suicide squeeze again last night in the tenth inning?
Isn’t bunting a relatively easy skill to master as long as you practice it? If a good bunt can get you even one extra win per season, shouldn’t all players be required to know how to do it well?
MW: Yes, they SHOULD all know how to bunt well, but they don’t.
- JasonMike
- TPDisappointing loss to say the least.After a great ninth they just couldn’t finish it off.Not to pick on Stewart but I thought he should of been up there hacking.Some of those pitches he got looked pretty good.Seems as though when these guys get a runner in scoring position with no one out,they hold back a little looking for the perfect pitch.I’m not trying to beat on Shannon in particular but I just think with no one out and Rolen,Wellsand Stairs waiting,Stew should have been a little more agressive. All in all it was still a good homestand.
Mike am I being hysterical to think that a repeat of the last road trip might very well end the jays playoff hopes?
please hold me, I’m scared :(
MW: There will be no physical contact.
- Paul OWilner, I thought you were turning the corner with respect to your criticism of J.P but the other night on ‘Wednesday Night with J.P’ you went back to being his ****. Oh well, guess you can’t expect Rome to be built in one day.
There’s no point asking anything about the offense. No matter how much I think this team needs Barry Bonds, or the fact that Shannon Stewart is done as a Major League ball player this team for all intents and purposes, isn’t going to change too much. It is currently brutal, and I disagree with you immensely that they need to just ‘wait it out’ as it will come along in due time.
On to my question, considering the Jays will need to play .611 ball (highly unlikely) the rest of the way just to be contending for the wild card, and with fan support lacking severely, at what point does upper management do something to try and increase fan support? Do they start slashing prices on tickets? I have tickets to a few Yankee games this year, but I’m going to wait until this team improves before committing to any others. Do you think I’m in the minority?
MW: You honestly expect me to answer a question after you start out with that kind of insult?
- BobbyMike,
I agree with pretty much everything you wrote – that was one frustrating loss.
Just one question though – in the 10th, after Wells was walked…
Why did Gibbons not let Inglett bat there (he was already in the game for Overbay anyway) and have lefty facing Wheeler, instead of going to Barajas?
This is nitpicking, obviously, but I’m curious.
MW: Inglett wasn’t in the game any more. He ran for Overbay, but Barajas came out to play first base in the top of the 10th.
- Scott ShepherdAs Navarro stepped to the plate I was screaming for Gibby to bring in Tallet. Not sure why, but it was almost like he couldn’t hear me, as unbelievable as that sounds. Anyways, he did a great job getting us to that point and giving the offense a chance so I can’t complain too much.
What a crappy game though. If I had had the energy to make it down to the Rogers Centre and sit through that thing I probably would’ve felt like never going back.
MW: Tallet wasn’t even up in the bullpen.
- Dan WHey Mike,
I was just wondering about the Blue Jays pitching coach, Brad Arnsberg. Ever since he took the reins back in 04, he has seemed to become an integeral part to the Blue Jays pitching success. How long is he signed for, and what is the probability of the Jays resigning him if his contract is nearly over?
MW: I think the whole coaching staff got two year deals after 2006.
- NickMike: Fellow bloggers, this is not a FT debate. I agree both parties needed to go in different directions…uh coasts-:) I also agree that Stairs still has a quick bat and want him to have a monster year.However, stats I’ve seen has him as the dh having 1 hr, 3 rbi’s in 55 ab’s. He seems to be getting a free pass for 75% less rbi’s in almost the same ab’s as the guy who was benched. Do you agree its no surprise that JP has not criticized his new DH’s lack of production? Stairs numbers when he is in the OF are alot better obviously. Maybe DH is not a good fit for him. Some can, some can’t. Sosa was an rbi machine behind only Ordonez and A-Rod per ab last year. I feel that is the overriding stat vs. OPS/avg. against rh pitching. For some reason $$$ or ? he sits home. Maybe a more realistic option would be Mike Sweeney. Oakland could get him back next year if they don’t resign Hurt or he retires. he’s worth a lot more in trade than he was over the winter obviously,
but he may be the best option of someone who IS hitting but still affordable. I hate taking a flyer on players who have failed repeatedly in recent seasons. I’d like to hear your thoughts Mike on Sweeney and how tough it is or isn’t to just dh. Thanks.
MW: RBIs per at-bat don’t mean much to me. You can’t drive in a run unless someone is on base in front of you (unless you hit a homer). If the Jays’ morals are preventing them from pursuing Bonds, then they can’t sign Sosa, either. Sweeney is still with Oakland now, there are other guys I’d rather have than him, such as Kevin Mench or even Josh Phelps.
- SkipKIf you can’t blame it on Stewart who can you blame it on? the dude went 0-6 and let a first pitch fast ball go by when all he had to do was make some contact. The Jays have no patience at all for Lind(despite his track record as a hitter throughout the minors) yet have patience for Stewart who doesn’t offer the upside(power) of Lind.
MW: Blame it on the whole whack of ‘em, though Stewart’s AB does stand out. Stewart has a track record in the bigs, Lind doesn’t.
- PeeWeeFirst, I’d like to comment about good baseball movies. The Natural and The Perfect Game are both in my collection as well as Field of Dreams. Bull Durham not so much.
Now, for the serious stuff. After reading The Star this morning about JP’s “off the record” Can You Guess Who is Coming To The Jays? talk, it seems to me that The Best Baseball Team in Canada is going after more than a has been named Wilkerson.
Anything less than a bona fide slugger is a waste of time and my Rogers cell phone bill payments. (Insert Rogers sound effect HERE)
By the way, Mike going 5-2 during this homestand is all fine and dandy. But going 1-2 against the Tampa Bay Rays is shameful.
KK
MW: No, it’s not.
- karim kanjiMike,
You sound like a broken record that’s been skipping for over a year, “the hitting
will come around” “the hitting will come around” …. and when it does the season is over. It turns out to be late in the season early in the season again.
MW: Bruno, at least you’re consistent. You didn’t comment at all during the five-game win streak, but you’re consistent.
- brunoI’m not sure if you notice it yesterday but when rios was on 3rd most hitters got 2-2 counts or 3-2 counts and the hitters that were hitting after rios just let the pitcher get ahead with the first pitch fastball. That was a horrible approach to take when you have a pitcher on the ropes. Yesterday the pressure should of been all over the pitcher but the hitters still seem to be fighting the pressure.
MW: You would be too, if you’d been outhit by little leaguers with runners in scoring position. It’s going to be a long time before the Jays believe that the pressure is on the pitcher they’re facing.
- oliverHi Mike;
What is your view on players that chew tobacco? aka chew, dip, cha, snuff, etc….
What would you say the percentage of players are doing it?
Is it true, that back when Troy Percival was with the Angels, he was placed on the DL because we was having such a hard time quitting?
I can remember when I was younger, about 10 years ago, I was there with some friends, and Pat Hentgan was in the bullpen warming up for his start….we asked him for his dip, and he just threw it up to us. During the same game, Tony Phillips of the tigers was out in left field, and he did the same. I still have both tins……
Is there anyone on the Jays that do it that we would be surprised by?….Doc, JMac, Overbay?
MW: I can’t think off the top of my head of guys who chew, except for John Gibbons, but I’m sure more than a few of them do. I think it’s disgusting.
- Andrew NMike, I was listening to your post game show last night, I thought it was crazy that you mentioned Pat Gillick and J.P in the same breath. J.P could not walk a mile in Pat Gillicks Shoes, I guess what you were trying to say in response to the caller giving much more credit to Pat. Was that Pat made his share of mistakes. I think at times your Homerism is ridiculous, P at Gillicks was a Genius that made trades, free agent signings and had draft picks that brought us back to back Championships. Pat Gillick Drafted Great hitting Tony Fernandez, Fred Mcgriff, John Olerud, Carlos Delgado. Not to mention Pitchers like David Wells,Tom Henke, Duane Ward. The list Goes on. I’ve also heard you say that Ash was horrible, I agree that Ash made moves that did not work out However ash Drafted Guys which are the nucleaus of our team today, RIOS,WELLS,DOC,Mcgowan. He also brought in Canseco and Roger Clemens, Conseco hit 46 home runs and drove in 100. Clemens Won Two Cy youngs and Doc is our ace.
J.P in his tenure has not brought in a guy that has hit thirty home runs for Toronto neither has
J.P made a move that I can say was a steal or makes him look like a genius. his Best moves In seven years have been Marcum and Hill.
MW: First of all, Gillick didn’t draft any of Fernandez, McGriff, Henke or Ward. Second of all, Ash didn’t sign Clemens, Paul Beeston did. Regardless, I’m not saying that Ricciardi and Gillick are comparable at all, but when the caller states things as facts that are untrue, I’m going to correct him. Pretending Gillick never made a bad trade or a bad sign or brought in crappy, mediocre players is equally ridiculous.
- NeilWell, let’s hope we can do some damage against the AL central these next 7 games. Are we facing 3 lefties this weekend in Cleveland?
As Dan Shulman said on PrimeTime with McCown and Brunt: “Just stay close to the Yankees because they are going to get better, and they have had suspect pitching in the past and someone from out of nowhere starts winning them games.” One game behind the Yanks with this anemic offence so far has to be encouraging.
Amazing how Overbay has started hitting the ball behind Wells, and no one want to get rid of him now.
MW: Three lefties in Cleveland, yes. Sabathia, Laffey and Lee.
- Aaron Ker$98 million is small town cheap:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=mlb&id=3325028
- Jim B“MW: I would have signed Barry Bonds a month ago.”
Ok…I’ll ask it another way. Knowing that JP et al won’t sign Bonds, what other drastic measures can be done to improve the offense?
MW: Dealing for a guy like Dunn or Bay would be at the top of my list, but I wouldn’t want to give up too much good, young pitching, and I don’t think those guys will get traded until closer to the all-star break.
- GlennMike Why do you want people to get excited about the jays five game win streak when A. Most of the games were low scoring.B The offense was still down during that win streak.C The pitching swept the series with Chicago. D
They did not gain any ground in the standings. Your such a homer. I never hear you challenge J.P as you challenge the fans. One other thing you try to make it seem like Shannon Stewart is that much of a great hitter than Reed. Reed Johnson was a killer with two outs and runners on,
MW: See, I don’t like this, because now I have to make it look like I don’t like Reed Johnson, which I do. Reed Johnson was most certainly NOT a killer with two outs and runners on. For his career, Reed has hit .280/.342/.404. With two out and runners on, Reed has hit .271/.327/.367 or to put it another way, worse than the average major-league hitter.
- JohnMW: “Yeah, five weeks says so much. At least you’re not on Reed Johnson anymore”
Mike I think you got people confused which is understandable but I never once said releasing Johnson was a bad move I was on your side the entire time. The only thing I mentioned on the topic was that neither Johnson nor Stewart was a good solution in left feild.
MW: My apologies. Too many negatories around here.
- Dan M.Yes the offense will pick up but that will be in August when the Blue Jays are well behind the race.
MW: OK, great seer.
- ImranJ.P.’s bins are truly magnificent. I wish that I too had such lovely bins.
MW: As do I.
- peteYou’re such a JP apologist, it makes Jays fans sick. Just stop.
MW: I’m not an apologist, I present facts.
- Marc LosierWhich injury do you think is more serisous? Johnny Mac or David Eskstein? Also when you were on with jp, you said Chris Paul should have won the MVP. I know you said you hate people based on this is kobe year. Can you tell me other reasons why you would have chosen Chris Paul over Kobe Bryant?
MW: McDonald’s is probably more serious, but I doubt either will be out more than 2 1/2 or 3 weeks. I didn’t say I hate people, I said I hate the fact that there can be a collective decision to give someone an award because of the sense that it’s “his year” to win it. That’s just stupid.
- andrewYou honestly think Lind and Purcey are enough to get Bay? If that was the case, the Jays would have done it already in a heartbeat. Purcey is not as good as you think b/c he has major control issues. Baseball America and the other publications do not think highly of him. As for Lind, he was a highly regarded prospect, but has done nothing in the Majors. The Jays would need to add more to get Bay. I would consider throwing in Litsch since he doesnt have the stuff to be anything more than a 5th starter and has had decent success in the majors. But, who would be the 5th starter if they trade purcey as well? Maybe not him. The Jays could throw in one of those good prospects they drafted last year as well.
MW: I think the Pirates would do Bay for Lind and Purcey without even letting J.P. off the phone to give him a chance to think about it.
- aviMike : Reverting to the Brantley – Denbo comments, we are dealing with professional hitters and there is only so many mechanical problems that can be rectified. This staff change makes as much sense as the Leafs letting Maurice go. The tail can’t wag the dog.
MW: I never really thought that Paul Maurice was the wunderkind he was hailed as almost unanimously when he came in here, so I don’t see that connection. But yes, there’s nothing to be gained by dumping Denbo, just as I didn’t think there was anything to be gained by dumping Brantley.
- JackMike-I am wondering if part of the problem with the Blue Jays’ lack of hitting is their less than aggressive approach.I get the feeling watching the games that many of the batters are going to the plate looking for a walk.Walks are nice but not as good as a hit in most cases.I am seeing a lot of good hitable pitches that are taken.What do you think?
MW: I think that most hitters are going to the plate looking for a good, hittable pitch, and the best way to do that is to get yourself in a good hitter’s count. I have a hard time thinking that they’re will to let a good pitch go in order to get another one, but it seems as though that’s been happening lately. However, I can still hear all the “why do they always swing at the first pitch” people ringing in my ears.
- Paul McCreath“Tallet wasn’t even up in the bullpen.”
You get the point Mike, but thanks for the snark.. Truly hilarious.
MW: It was Camp’s first bad outing of the season, and he didn’t even pitch that badly until the slam.
- Dan WMike, what about Jim Edmonds as a possible DH/OF? I do like Botts over Wilkerson though. Pin the loss the the team failing to score runs, not one individual, I agree with you on that one.
Thanks,
Tom
MW: I think the guy who comes in should be a right-handed hitting legit lefty masher. That’s not Edmonds. It’s not Wilkerson either, though.
- tom stewartI just can’t believe someone said the Simpsons is not culturally relevant….I’m still shaking my head.
- WeezMike, I heard you on the radio last night. You say you like to talk fact. The fact is this, J.P cannot walk a mile in Pat Gillicks shoes. In a call last night on your show it almost sounded like you were trying to put J.P and Gillick in the same breath when a caller was doggin J.P. I think @ times you can be such a homer and utter things that make no sense. Gillick was the last GM to get us into the playoffs and win a championships. He was simply a genius putting together a pitching staff consisting of Pat Hengan, Jimmy Key, David, Wells, Mike Timlin, Duane Ward, Juan Guzman and the list goes on. Not to mention Brining in Bats through the Draft such as Fred Mcgriff, Tony, Fernandez, John Olerud,Shawn Green and Delgado and through trades and free agency Such as Ricky Henderson, Devon White, Paul Molitor, Candy Maldanado, Joe Carter and Roberto Alamar. J.P just does not measure up. I’ve heard you also dogg former GM Gord Ash. Lets not forget Gord Ash is reponsible for the core that is in place today consisting of RIOS,WELLS,HALLDDAY,MCGOWAN, He also brought in a big hitter in Jose Conseco back in 98 who hit 46 home Runs 100RBI’s and brought in Roger Clemens who won two cy young awards. There is no trade, free Agent Signing or Draft Pick that J.P has made that makes me say wow. ith the exception of Hill and Marcum.
MW: Using a different name and e-mail address (but the same IP address) when you put up the same post a second time doesn’t make you more right.
- RogerIn answer to Robert Dudek’s question about average hitting and great pitching teams, just look at the 2005 White Sox, a team that won the World Series with great pitching and defense and below average hitting.
(I think it’s hard to expect more than 85-90 wins that way, though–those White Sox outperformed their expected wins-loss record by about 10 games.)
As to the griping about losing to lowly Tampa Bay, the new-look Rays are a good squad. I fear everybody in the East but Boston will be looking up at them all year.
MW: That White Sox team hit a crapload of home runs, though. The Rays will not finish second in the division.
- MichaelI just dont get why this team can’t put Lind out there everyday and let him do his thing…. I would take Lind over Stewart, Wilkerson or Botts any day of the week…
Im losing my faith in JP over the last season….
MW: You seem to have a lot of company here.
- SteveHey Mike, I was wondering if you would place the offensive struggles solely on the hitters or partly on Gibbons because last night for example he could have put on a squeeze to bring Rios home from third and win the game with Stewart up.
MW: Solely on the hitters.
- JayWell at least “a” plan is working out, its maybe the least we can expect after 7 years. The plan for an offensive juggernaught over the last 2 years has so far failed to pan out. The whole sign MacDonald to a multi year deal to play every day, then sign Ecstein to play every day limiting Mac to pinch running duties before this week. The whole left field revolving door thing, that ridiculous Thomas contract, giving A.J. an opt out after 3 years, all points to a G.M. flying by the seat of his pants
MW: I don’t know what the A.J. opt-out has to do with any of your other points, but I kind of see it as an effort to be as good as possible, and always looking to be better.
- Phil SmithYou honestly think AJ’s more likely to throw a second no-hitter than the other four guys are to get one? Not that I would necessarily say it’s less likely, given the luck factor…
MW: I didn’t say a second one. Seriously, though, it’s a coin flip. McGowan took one into the 9th, Marcum has taken a couple into the 7th, heck, Litsch was perfect through 4 2/3 last night. Many great pitchers have thrown no-no’s, but so have many very average pitchers.
- Rob_NSIt’s not Brad Wilkerson. It’s Ryan Freel. Okay – what do I win?
MW: Nothing? There are no prizes for being wrong.
- JayjayWell, I thought the stars were aligning last night when two players who have been struggling got key hits- Hill’s single in the 9th and Rios’ triple in the 10th. But alas, I put the cart before the horse. The Jays might set a record this year for most times stranding a lead-off triple…I hope they don’t keep track of that kind of stat.
And I may be overly negative here but when I hear names like Wilkerson and Phelps as the guys we may bring in to give us another bat I cringe. Surely there must be better options, no? I know they can be had cheaply and easily but still, I’m skeptical at best.
An encouraging and discouraging loss all at the same time last night. At least in baseball the next day brings a new game and new hope.
MW: Actually, Phelps was a pretty good lefty-crusher. So is Mench, who they actually got.
- B-rad from CalgaryHI Mike, When I questioned JP on Wed night about the quick trigger finger with Lind, he say that Stewart has to play every day. Now he picks up Wilkerson to give Stewart a break. Please tell me this is not true.
MW: I think Wilkerson is more to give Overbay a break against lefties. I think Stewart still plays at least five days a week.
- WayneYou caled some of the bandwagon jumpers :negatories” but this sounds more appropriate for the gov’t in Ottawa. I prefer the term “negatoids” as it rhymes with another very annoying condition.
The finale against the Rays (why not the Bobs, the Freds or the Johns??) is better left forgotten, but hopefullly the fire has been lit under both Rios and Hill to get them out of their slumpage.
- skip laboefMike
Who would it take to get Bay -not Purcey? And what’s his contract situation?
Thanks
MW: They could get him for Brett Cecil, I bet. Bay is signed through next season, $5.75 this year, $7.5 next.
- DanHi Mike,
If the Jays were in the wild card mix later in the season, but were still finding that they were too light in the hitting department, do you think J.P. might entertain the possibility of trading a Marcum or McGowan? I don’t really advocate trading either but I know that those are the two guys that teams are asking about and J.P. surely knows the importance for the franchise to see post season play.
And if he did move one of those guys, what calibre of player would come this way? A #5 or 6 hitter in the lineup? I’m a little unsure as to what the market would be for those young arms.
In posing this question, I should also say that both pitchers continue to slay me. Just when I think they can’t possibly top themselves they rip through another lineup in astonishing fashion. They keep me going to the ballpark.
Go Jays.
MW: I think he would entertain offers for either one, but the return would have to be a game-breaking, put-you-over-the-top, huge-bat kind of guy who was still under control for a while beyond this year.
- ColeMLB Transaction Wire:
5/9/08
Acquired OF Kevin Mench from the Texas Rangers for cash considerations; Signed OF Brad Wilkerson; Designated LHP Gustave Chacin and INF Sergio Santos for assignment; Optioned INF Joe Inglett to Triple-A Syracuse.
Well we knew about Wilkerson, but the Mench thing is a pleasant surprise I guess.
MW: See the latest post.
- DougOh my goodness!!
Reed Johnson just scored a run for the Cubbies….Fans of Toronto unite, bring back Johnson!!
(please detect my sarcasm)
We need a hitter, our defense is fine. Reed Johnson is not a hitter.
Bay, Dunn, Bonds are hitters….sure they may lack a little in the field, but they are going to win you more games with their bats, then games they are going to loose you with their gloves!
MW: Or even lose you.
- Andrew NWhat is it with all these people thinking you are obligated to criticize JP just for the sake of doing it?
And a big LOL at the guy who posed as another person with the same IP to repeat his stupid remarks.
I feel sorry for anyone in this town who pines for the days of Gord Ash.
And by the way, Pat Gillick never had to deal with two crazy high spending teams in his own division. IN FACT, the Jays had the HIGHEST payroll in the majors in 92 and 93 and the Sox and Yanks weren’t even close. So chew on that JP haters.
Here’s a link to historic payrolls: http://www.baseballchronology.com/Baseball/Years/1992/Payroll.asp
- ShawnMike, you seem to take a lot of c**p from people on this blog, not to mention the radio, and most of it is undeserved, especially the J.P. patsy comments. That said, I will accuse you of having faith that this is a good club, and I still believe that’s an entirely subjective position (without much merit, other than being your opinion).
Objectively, I see a team only aspiring for mediocrity: their pitching is out-of-this-world, but the hitters – even if they heat-up – only constitute an average line-up. They’ve made some strides over the years – remember those dark days when Koskie was the 4 or 5 hitter? – but offensively they’re far from being an opposing team’s worst nightmare. I wonder how you assess this club if they were hitting a bit better. Are they playoff contenders? I don’t think they are anything other than a .500 club, but I’d love to read your assessment of this team (and pretend in your assessment that they can actually bring home a runner from time to time).
MW: If they were hitting just to the major-league average with runners in scoring position, I believe they’d be about 22-12 instead of 16-18.
- AndyI’d rather have Ted Lilly batting with Rios on 3rd last night. I’ll bet you a DQ blizzard that the Jays get 82 wins or less. I love them and am soo fricking frustrated. Someone create excitement, sign Bonds.
MW: I’d take that bet. Can it be a Banana Cream Pie Blizzard? Those rock.
- nicky zYour reply to comment #15 [MW: Funny how people say J.P. “has no plan” but then attribute the emergence of Marcum and McGowan to luck].
McGowan wasn’t JP’s plan, he’s a leftover from Ash’s regime and I’m sure there were many times before 2006 & 2007 that he debated about trading him. As for Marcum, I give props to JP for grabbing him in the 3rd round of the ’03 draft, BUT JP’s modus operandi in his early drafts was to get low ceiling MLB serviceable talent and I’m sure that JP only envisioned Marcum being a middle reliever at best with a 3rd rounder and has gotten “somewhat lucky” with him being arguably the best #4 starter in the AL.
MW: You’re sure that’s how JP envisioned him. The fact that he didn’t trade McGowan, as he did with a lot of the Ash folk he was left over with, and worked to get an extra option year on him to keep him around longer is just luck, too, right?
- JJJP’s solution to the Jays hitting problems by creating a carousel of outfielders, hoping one of them hits is reminiscent of the lineup of potential 5th starters he created last year. We all know how that ended up.
I am willing to give the Jays a little more time. The season is just so damn long. But if these trends persist, the Jays may have to get desperate and bring in a sports psychologist or motivational speaker to get these guys out of their hitting Slumber.
MW: Ummmm, it ended up with Dustin McGowan and Shaun Marcum in the rotation.
- AKMike,
I’ve discussed the Purcey/Lind for Bay scenario with some very knowledgeable guys in my keeper league, and the near unanimous consensus is that the Jays do that deal in a heartbeat.
MW: Congratulations.
- GregJPMike, don’t even bother responding to the personal attacks by some of the commenters. I think it just encourages them. Commenters, make a real argument and stop personal attacks against Mike. Be thankful that he takes so much time to read your comments and anwer them.
- brentLead off triple, stranded on third.
Does anyone remember B.J. Ryan’s first appearance this year — Oh, yeah, lead off triple, left on third.
Or how about the Carlson relief appearance — bases loaded, none out, strikes out the side!
My point — it happens, folks, and sometime it happens in the Jays’ favor, as well.
- NormI listened to PTS today and Bob Cat wondered why they got two outfielders instead of two shortstops to replace Johnny Mac and David Eskstein. Can you explain that to me? Also do you think C.C sabathia will rebound from his terrible start since he’s killing me in my fantasy league?
MW: Because the shortstops will be back in two weeks. Yeah, C.C. will be just fine.
- andrewAlso what you could you get if you trade Marcum or McGowan? I don’t avocate trading them but i’m just wondering what their market valuw would be?
MW: A big, enormous, bucketload of stuff.
- andrew“MW: Ummmm, it ended up with Dustin McGowan and Shaun Marcum in the rotation.”
Actually no.. both those individuals were already within the Jays organization. The myriad of players brought in externally failed miserably. It is directly applicable to what he (JP) is doing now.
Perhaps he should’ve learned from the emergence of Marcum and Mcgowan and given Lind an extended run.
MW: What does the fact that they were both in the organization have to do with that question?
- AKMike .. at no point did a pose a question. This is a comment section, I was merely stating my opinion that JP’s solution to the Jays hitting woes is similar to what his solution was to the question of who the fifth starter was last year — bringing in underperforming and trying-to-revive-stagnant-career players.
Shaun Marcum and McGowan’s emergences were not a result of JP signing Toma Okha et all. There were good young talent within the Jays organization which should be what JP should be looking at now (see Adam Lind)
MW: You didn’t pose a question, but you referred to my answer to a question in a previous post.
- AK